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Home > Maintenance & Mods (L322) > ZF 5HP24 Transmission rebuild - How To ? It begins.....

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andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

Just a question , you think that I can reassembly the box, or I have to replace some other part before.
Meanwhile, today I disassembled the valve body,

and measured resistance solenoids, but do not understand why the first seems different and with no sound

I also worked on the oil pan

the strange thing is, that this seal had remained attached to the block

then I checked thickness with a micrometer, all plates

can assemby my box?

11th Jul 2015 10:58pm

andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

replacing the countersunk screws in the package F, I found only this, that are M8X25 instead of M8x24 position 77,210
I can't understand what is 77.220

Click image to enlarge

they are not torx like OEM, but hexagonal 5mm.
the thread is equal to the original, 1 mm longer, close to the head
the class is 10.9 instead of 8.8

think could be a problem, even tightening, will change?

14th Jul 2015 9:43am

RRPhil

Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

Sorry, just catching up after a weekend away.

Just ignore 77.220. I think it’s supposed to represent an alignment tool to assist with the replacement of the F-brake drum back into the casing (to help get the holes to line up).

You will need to check that the longer screws won’t touch the back of the clutch piston.

Click image to enlarge

Otherwise you will be taking out the clearance in the clutch pack which could at best cause drag and at worst cause the plates to burn.

These screws are only tightened to 23Nm and, as I mentioned to Pete earlier on in this post (http://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/post319415.html#319415), they are only difficult to remove because of the friction on the taper and not because the screws are ‘soft’.

Phil

Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated

14th Jul 2015 10:47am

RRPhil

Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

andrew.aa wrote:

the strange thing is, that this seal had remained attached to the block

Yes, the gasket usually ‘welds’ itself to the orifice plate close to the seven screws which clamp it to the duct plate.

Click image to enlarge

You need to remove the old gasket carefully ensuring that you don’t scratch the plate in the process.

Phil

Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated

14th Jul 2015 11:14am

RRPhil

Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

andrew.aa wrote:

The A clutch drum, seems to be worn

I need to double-check but I think this area is machined just to clean up the beam weld joining the drum to the shaft. The A-clutch piston has a corresponding annular cutout cast into its back to ensure that it sits squarely in the drum when ‘off’ and doesn’t rest on the weld spatter. It’s therefore nothing to be concerned about.

Phil

14th Jul 2015 11:30am

andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

[quote]'

Quote:
'Yes, the gasket usually ‘welds’ itself to the orifice plate close to the seven screws which clamp it to the duct plate.

not in mind

Quote:
they are only difficult to remove because of the friction on the taper and not because the screws are ‘soft’.

yes I read many forums with the same problem,the best advice is your advice, loosen before removing inside packages, and have muchr weight.

Quote:
You will need to check that the longer screws won’t touch the back of the clutch piston.

the inner flange measure 6,6mm
the hole of the package F measure 19 mm up to piston F
then I think it's a risk to mount these, which is why the original are 24mm
think Jpat can supply the original ones? and what part number for Torque converter bolts?
what's about small cracks above , on D/E clutch drum
RRPhil, thanks for coming back to me

14th Jul 2015 12:11pm

RRPhil

Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

andrew.aa wrote:
...and measured resistance solenoids, but do not understand why the first seems different and with no sound

Yes, I agree that your MV3 solenoid winding resistance is a bit higher than usual. Strange. However, the chances are that the solenoid will never get called into use during the whole lifetime of the vehicle. It’s only there in the event of you inadvertently moving the gear selector lever into reverse while travelling forward at speed. MV3 is then activated by the controller to pressurise the end of the reverse gear valve (51.180) so that the manual valve is overruled and the C & F clutches aren’t engaged.

MV3 is pulsed on in Park & Neutral, presumably to test it and prevent it malfunctioning due to lack of use.

The function of the MV1 & MV2 solenoids (i.e. the other two brown solenoids) is much more critical as they actually activate the gear shifts.

Phil

14th Jul 2015 1:24pm

RRPhil

Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

andrew.aa wrote:
think Jpat can supply the original ones?

JPAT have certainly supplied me with the countersunk screws in the past. Their part number is N208 37 01.

Phil

14th Jul 2015 1:29pm

andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

thanks Phil
as imagined, it would be better to replace it or not,
speed sensors are respectively 337Ω and 334Ω, so I think ok.
I can't find Tightening torques for valve body.

14th Jul 2015 1:56pm

andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Phil, I make a table, like your, for free spring measuring , but I haven't references for comparation-

Click image to enlarge

Can you please take a look.
and I have an important question.
why when the transmission stuck in 4a gear, with failsafe message, reversing working properly without any problems?

14th Jul 2015 5:50pm

andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

I'm still here guys, hope can help somebody, so after a research, the only thing found in the net,
ZF 5HP24 valve body spring specifications
unfortunately the inch system is not for me, so in red are mm

Click image to enlarge

but I can't understand why in this manual
SV-1 SV-2 and KV-B have different size, but have also the same part number 0732 041 462
anyone have experience about

17th Jul 2015 2:50pm

RRPhil

Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

These are the groups of identical springs :

SV-1, SV-2, KV-D, KV-E = 0732 041 462

WK-V, DR-V2 = 0732 042 504

Mod-V, Absch-V-A = 0732 042 123

HV-B, KV-F = 0732 041 526

D-2, D-3, D-4 = 0732 042 561

HV-D, DR-V1, HV-E = 0732 041 809

Many of your spring free lengths are a little small against my measurements. That’s either because the springs are tired or maybe just because our measurement method is slightly different. I take the reading just as the spring falls out of the jaws of the vernier under its own weight.

Your D-A and D-C measurements are back-to-front. The long spring is for the A-clutch accumulator.

Click image to enlarge

SV-1 looks long (46.5mm compared with SV-2=45.7mm, KV-D=45.8mm & KV-E=45.8mm). Strange.

The missing dimension for the Schm-V spring should be around 42.6mm.

The ATSG figures for spring lengths apply to the early transmissions before the hydraulics were revised i.e. for model numbers 005/009/013/014/015/016/024. A number of the springs are different to your 032 model.

Phil

Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated

19th Jul 2015 12:09am

RRPhil

Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

andrew.aa wrote:
why when the transmission stuck in 4a gear, with failsafe message, reversing working properly without any problems?

The transmission is designed to provide limp-home in the event of an electrical malfunction so reverse and 4th do not require activation of the solenoids. Their hydraulic circuits are fed directly off the manual valve connected to the gear selector lever. This is the reason that the main pressure proportional solenoid (the one with the green cap) provides full pressure at zero current and then a falling pressure characteristic with increasing current e.g. if you pull the wires off you get full mains pressure. The black-cap proportional solenoids operate in the opposite direction i.e. zero current = zero pressure.

Phil

19th Jul 2015 11:36am

andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Quote:
These are the groups of identical springs :
SV-1, SV-2, KV-D, KV-E = 0732 041 462
WK-V, DR-V2 = 0732 042 504
Mod-V, Absch-V-A = 0732 042 123
HV-B, KV-F = 0732 041 526
D-2, D-3, D-4 = 0732 042 561
HV-D, DR-V1, HV-E = 0732 041 809

yes I know as ZF PARTS CAT

Quote:
Many of your spring free lengths are a little small against my measurements. That’s either because the springs are tired or maybe just because our measurement method is slightly different. I take the reading just as the spring falls out of the jaws of the vernier under its own weight.

This morning I checked again and just a little difference with the first one

Click image to enlarge

so I think the springs that have more than +/-0.7mm of difference are to be replaced.. I 'm wrong?
for example D-A should be 77,9mm but about 1,5mm missing

Click image to enlarge

and D-C spring is over too long,

Click image to enlarge

Quote:
Your D-A and D-C measurements are back-to-front. The long spring is for the A-clutch accumulator.SV-1 looks long (46.5mm compared with SV-2=45.7mm, KV-D=45.8mm & KV-E=45.8mm). Strange.

I can't understand

Quote:
The missing dimension for the Schm-V spring should be around 42.6mm.

infact my spring is 43mm

Quote:
The ATSG figures for spring lengths apply to the early transmissions before the hydraulics were revised i.e. for model numbers 005/009/013/014/015/016/024. A number of the springs are different to your 032 model.

Yes I know that is for audi porsche bmw but is the only reference found
Anyway on the ZF PARTS CAT only KV-E /55.150 have two different part number

51.060/51.080/51.140 (SV-1/SV-2/KV-D) are for ''ALL''

this is why I was confused

Quote:
The transmission is designed to provide limp-home in the event of an electrical malfunction so reverse and 4th do not require activation of the solenoids. Their hydraulic circuits are fed directly off the manual valve connected to the gear selector lever. This is the reason that the main pressure proportional solenoid (the one with the green cap) provides full pressure at zero current and then a falling pressure characteristic with increasing current e.g. if you pull the wires off you get full mains pressure. The black-cap proportional solenoids operate in the opposite direction i.e. zero current = zero pressure.

thank you Phil, really thanks.

19th Jul 2015 1:17pm

andrew.aa

Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

finally the box is completed with new converter

but I have some questions

is tis correct or something missing

this seal is correct or not

i dont' know location for parts below, two screws I think valve body but I can't find location
the oring inside bag n.3 jpat

is normal that no endfloat on fron side?

30th Jul 2015 4:47pm

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