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Home > Maintenance & Mods (L322) > ZF 5HP24 Transmission rebuild - How To ? It begins.....
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2032

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

Well, judging by the light shining through that casing, you are balls deep already with a rebuild/full check over etc.
. my same bearing only had some swarf pick up on some needles, but you have some missing. - I'm guessing you need to look for those, maybe inside the filter, or checking they're not potentially in clutch areas. Or gone through the epicyclic gear.
You have gone far further than I did, so can only guide you on what I wrote up above. -obviously refer to your pictures, and keep us in the loop as we may be able to assist your rebuild.

Post #336380 7th Jul 2015 9:58pm
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Haylands



Member Since: 04 Mar 2014
Location: East Yorkshire
Posts: 8195

England 2014 Range Rover Autobiography SDV8 Loire Blue

Yes, you will have to find those two, could be in the valve body somewhere preventing it from doing what it should, if you can't find them I wonder if they could get inside the torque converter...

The clutch packs are usually OK unless you have had the wrong oil in it in which can lead to problems.. and yes those bolts are a pain to get out... Pete

__________________________________________________
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2011 L322 Vogue SE 4.4 TDV8 Baltic Blue. Parchment over Navy Interior. Sold
2012 L322 Autobiography 5.0 Supercharged Ipanema Sand, Jet Interior. Sold
2002 L322 Vogue 4.4 V8 Epson Green, Ivory over Aspen Interior (Fatty Offroader) Sold
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Post #336387 7th Jul 2015 10:25pm
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andrew.aa



Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Italy 2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

thanks for interest, those two missing, are on the table,near bearing but out the image, don't warry,

Click image to enlarge

those bolts are too soft

and tomorrow I will search for other harder bolts
anyway for who want many other pictures are available on my flickr page
comparing the old steel plates with new ones, there are no differences , very little for clutch discs
this is one of D clutch

checking the purchased parts, the front seal that you speak about, is included in my order as ZF number 0734 319 520 Shaft seal
Aso the wear bearing in the image is ZF n. 1058 202 016 01 already purchased

Post #336389 7th Jul 2015 10:56pm
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andrew.aa



Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Italy 2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

Today I built three rings like Assembly bracket for pressure down cups springs, but decided leave the old clutch and steel plates
Then I open the pump and remove the oil seal were talking about and that I will have to buy


Then I removed the piston F I thought the problem was the reverse, it seems to be ok



so I went to the replacement of the package E and D, but do not understand where I have to put 74,140 74,150

those points as of hammered into the casing are normal or not










have you fitted all the parts in the overhaull kit?
Anyway, I do not think that the cause of the problems is in there, too tidy, it could be the TC or valve body or a sensor
what do you think, it is possible to check sensors?

Post #336543 8th Jul 2015 9:12pm
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2032

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

I don't know how the contact marks on the casing have appeared, but seemingly it's from sideways movement of the main drums? Doubt it's the loose roller bearings. Perhaps the bronze bearing shells show the wear? Those I believe pull out, mine were gold with no damage/wear etc. they look like circular crankshaft bearings, ie one piece. That pump seal I mentioned, pops off the front, even when in situ etc. not the rear of the pump...have you discovered the centre drum with the o ring yet? That I pictured etc?

Post #336550 8th Jul 2015 9:33pm
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RRPhil



Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

United Kingdom 

If you’ve had issues with reverse then it’s important that you replace O-rings 74.140 and 74.150

Click image to enlarge


I’ve come across failures of these O-rings on several rebuilds

Click image to enlarge


The steel bush can simply be tapped out of the D/E clutch drum using a drift from the E-clutch side

Click image to enlarge


Phil

P.S. I have two Engineers in my office who are Italian and their English is better than mine so if it’s easier for you to post in Italian I could ask them to translate?

Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated Mr. Green

Post #336624 9th Jul 2015 12:04pm
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andrew.aa



Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Italy 2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

this mean that I heve to disassemble D/E another time, just today assembled.
ok I wil do it
but IS This normal



part inside red circle C CLUTCH/ have to be fitted with exact position of holes or not

this is my temporary tool with two size

my temporary tool



thanks Phil, sure in Italian could be much easy for me, but all your great expletations are clear for me, maybe not the same for you with my English.
think you I have to do recon TORQUE C, and valve block

Post #336665 9th Jul 2015 3:57pm
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RRPhil



Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

United Kingdom 

“but IS This normal”

I assume you’re asking about the clutch wavy plate? This is a cushion spring fitted in each of the six clutch packs between the piston and the first steel plate and, yes, it’s supposed to look like that

“part inside red circle C CLUTCH/ have to be fitted with exact position of holes or not”

No, you don’t need to line any holes up as there’s an annular space machined into the drum for the flow to be distributed around. Just make sure that you insert the sun gear drive sleeve into the C-clutch drum fully until the sleeve hits the stop i.e. the second O-ring is fully engaged

You should always check the phosphor bronze bushes in the sleeve for wear as they act as seals for the C-clutch hydraulic circuit (which is only used in reverse). The shaft will measure Ø31.96mm and the bush should have an inside diameter between Ø32.01 and Ø32.03 - and no bigger.

I’m very impressed by your clutch spring compression tool – excellent. I'll add it to my photo collection. Here’s another one that someone sent me a picture of:

Click image to enlarge


Superb!


Your torque converter won’t be responsible for your transmission problem but it’s a good idea to get it re-manufactured by someone who knows what they’re doing as the lock-up clutch has a finite life before the ‘cattle grid’ noise begins due to wear of the friction plate – usually at just over 100k miles. It's a specialist job though as the LUC piston stop has to be un-welded and then welded back again to a precise dimension.

Before you start on the valve block you really need to check the condition of the A-to-B clutch O-ring and see if the pads on the B-clutch hub have been touched due to the bearing failure.

Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge

Pads untouched


Click image to enlarge

Pads machined


Phil

Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated Mr. Green

Post #336708 9th Jul 2015 9:44pm
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andrew.aa



Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Italy 2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

Thanks Phil, your help is like gold
yes I asnking about clutch wavy plate
you are very nice but my extraction tool is built in twenty minutes, tomorrow I'll send you the other one, and sure the above tool is really superb.
about C CLUTCH I imagined as you say, but I wanted for your confirm
tommorrow will check for phosphor bronze bushes
the pads on the B-clutch hub Have not been touched and tomorrow will post image about drum
if I decide for TORQUE CONVERTER overhaull will be sent to JPAT as agreement

Post #336724 9th Jul 2015 11:37pm
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2032

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

just a quick question here regarding those b clutch pads, I noticed that mine had indeed been scuffed a bit, but not as bad as the ones above, what was the concequence of that?

as mentioned on previous pages, I got away with an 'O' ring and a couple of bearings that had picked up, possibly some 'pad swarf' ???

personally, I'm really glad I didn't do further inspections, as this is getting very deep now. and my box is going fine now.

Post #336749 10th Jul 2015 8:32am
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RRPhil



Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 963

United Kingdom 

There’s no consequence as such, and the hub can be reused - the pad wear just gives a useful indication of how far the bearing damage had gone. The critical thing is to dig out and replace the steel washer too as it’s likely to be wafer thin (and therefore razor sharp, so care is required)

Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge



Provided the hub itself hasn’t worn underneath the steel washer the front assembly end float should then still be within specification (0.20-0.40mm) after the rebuild.

Click image to enlarge



When I repair a 5HP24 with the common bearing/O-ring issue, in 95% of cases I don’t find anything else whatsoever wrong with the transmission when I tear it down to each of its 666 components, so in all likelihood you did the right thing stopping at that point.

Phil

Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated Mr. Green

Post #336764 10th Jul 2015 10:09am
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2032

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

well Phil, that's very relieving to know.
my gearbox had already had a full rebuild less than 20,000 miles previous, by the previous owner. I have the full £2250 job receipt still and its two years ago, so one year over its warranty. I called in, and discussed what they could do, and mentioned it might be the o ring, but they said 'bring it down' etc, and some sort of pro talk, and 'We will look at it, etc'
but I knew that once they had it in pieces, I was going to be in for an identical bill and they would (might) be just replacing the o ring etc. I decided I could fall back on this, so tried successfully to do the job myself.

This was a autobox specialist, they only do gearboxes etc, they have branches in Croydon, and Wimbledon. etc. though the Wimbledon branch had a floor more akin to a skating rink, with the amount of fluid soaked in, under my wet boots etc. they also ha a similar range rover in the air !
I'm very glad that I did the job, and was quite interested how it works etc. its a beautiful piece of precision engineering, that we take for granted. until it goes wrong.

my first ever gearbox teardown was more like this.... but it was junk....

Post #336766 10th Jul 2015 10:38am
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andrew.aa



Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Italy 2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

today not much time for the box, we have only just begun .... weekend ahead
as you say, B CLUTCH hub, shows slight signs of wear, also outside










here with high res
https://flic.kr/p/vQ586v
The A clutch drum, seems to be worn

and finally new torque wrench Mr. Green

Post #336787 10th Jul 2015 2:57pm
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andrew.aa



Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Italy 2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

without your help I would not solved Embarassed


and noticed these small cracks,
inside





outside

near the hole

What should I do, replace or what Question

Post #336793 10th Jul 2015 4:45pm
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andrew.aa



Member Since: 16 Aug 2011
Location: PERUGIA
Posts: 102

Italy 2004 Range Rover Westminster 4.4 V8 Java Black

bronze bushe outside is ok with the correct diameter, but the other one inside is not possible take size,but it seems a bit worn where the color faded

Post #336796 10th Jul 2015 6:04pm
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