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PeterRRVogue



Member Since: 22 Jan 2022
Location: Brackley
Posts: 72

United Kingdom 

Hey guys,

sorry for no updates recently. I've been cracking on with the engine disassembly taking my time to stay organised and clean and inspect all the parts as I go along (and what a task the cleaning part has been!). I'm basically stripped it to the block and tonight planning on taking the crank and pistons out so I can hopefully take the heads, block, crank etc to try local machining shop to assess the damage. It's obvious that the damage has been caused by utterly neglected oil change (or it might have a micro crack in the block causing a coolant leak?), the state of oil caused the main bearing to spin (I can see that even before removing the crank). The question right now is if the wear is beyond the acceptable tolerances on the block, crank, heads, etc. I've been in touch with a local machining shop so going to take it to them for damage assessment / machining work.

Here are some photos, but I've been video recording the whole process and will post the whole thing on YouTube once I have a bit of time for editing.

Post #636806 13th Jul 2022 11:18am
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PeterRRVogue



Member Since: 22 Jan 2022
Location: Brackley
Posts: 72

United Kingdom 

just a few photos as promised. No matter how bad things look on these photos, trust me when I say it was worse, I just was too filthy to be taking photos of the most sludged up stages. Definitely beyond my wildest imagination. Still cannot comprehend how someone could neglect a car like this..



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Post #636807 13th Jul 2022 11:23am
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dhallworth



Member Since: 10 Oct 2011
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 3097

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Autobiography TDV8 Baltic Blue

Holy Censored , that's a mess!

I wonder if it has been a general lack of maintenance or if something else has gone wrong.

I'd enjoy the mechanical side of what you're doing but that clean up will be an utter nightmare!

What sort of state are the cams in? Have then become scored or worn?

David. 2002 4.6 Vogue SE - Alveston Red with Lightstone Leather
2007 Range Rover Supercharged in Java Black with Ivory Leather
2012 Range Rover 5.0 SC Autobiography in Indus Silver with Jet/Ivory Interior
2012 Range Rover 4.4 TDV8 Autobiography in Baltic Blue with Sand Interior

Post #636815 13th Jul 2022 12:12pm
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PeterRRVogue



Member Since: 22 Jan 2022
Location: Brackley
Posts: 72

United Kingdom 

Quote:
I wonder if it has been a general lack of maintenance or if something else has gone wrong.


yes, that's why I'm not ruling out the possibility of a cracked block allowing the coolant leak into the oil, causing the sludge. Hope the machining shop will be able to X-ray the block for me.

Quote:
I'd enjoy the mechanical side of what you're doing but that clean up will be an utter nightmare!

I cannot began describing how much time I spent on the clean up so far and the amount of mess that I had to deal with. Wish I had space for a proper parts cleaner box in my garage

Quote:
What sort of state are the cams in? Have then become scored or worn?

There is naturally some visible wear on the cams, but most of it cannot be felt with a nail so hopefully the machining shop will be able to polish it off. I haven't done any tolerance measuring yet as I have been busy with the cleaning, but hopefully will have a detailed damage report later on this week. Fingers crossed


Last edited by PeterRRVogue on 13th Jul 2022 12:56pm. Edited 1 time in total

Post #636817 13th Jul 2022 12:52pm
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dingg1



Member Since: 29 Jun 2013
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 1345

2007 Range Rover Vogue SE 4.2 SC V8 Stornoway Grey

Looks likely that its never had an oil change in its life Shocked

Post #636819 13th Jul 2022 12:55pm
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PeterRRVogue



Member Since: 22 Jan 2022
Location: Brackley
Posts: 72

United Kingdom 

Quote:
Looks likely that its never had an oil change in its life Shocked


Yes, and I hope that's the case, as the alternative might be a cracked block Big Cry

Post #636821 13th Jul 2022 1:00pm
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GraemeS



Member Since: 06 Mar 2015
Location: Wagga area
Posts: 2486

Australia 2012 Range Rover Autobiography TDV8 Bournville

The sludge wouldn't be black if coolant was mixed with the oil, it would be a creamy colour.

You're very keen - I would have just replaced the engine.

Post #636849 13th Jul 2022 9:06pm
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JayGee



Member Since: 27 Jul 2021
Location: London
Posts: 3236

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Orkney Grey

Looks like neglected oil changes but would it look much different in any of our 4.4 at high miles even with the correct service intervals.
I’m doing 5k mile oil changes and I’m not being overly cautious when I see the state of the old oil. 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

Post #636850 13th Jul 2022 9:25pm
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2032

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

wow. the amount of black death in there! i cant see thats a coolant leak at all. its like the wrong grade of oil, (mineral?) has been put in, and too long ago! yes you might have some oil staravation problems, and a run bearings(s) but if you take all your filthy parts to the machine shop, they will put them in a steamer, and they will be out looking fabulous. you can sort of do all the bits together in their giant dishwasher. might be worth it, as there will be orfices that you dont know of yet. looks like the goo was still like jelly, and not like burnt toast scrapings!, ie in granular form. which might have done even worse damage. im optomistic you will get a good report once cleaned and inspected..... you just have to remember how to get it back together. and time is the factor there, with memory etc... but you did wisely to film your teardown.

Post #636862 14th Jul 2022 9:21am
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garyRR



Member Since: 13 Mar 2021
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 1468

United Kingdom 

Remember a head has combustion, cooling and oil channels in it. The crack doesn't have to be between cooling and oil. It can be between combustion and oil, which seems a more likely outcome than coolant leaking, given the sludgey oil which could be coked up with excessive carbon.

But let's hope it's not a cracked head(s).

Ps, I'm envious of the width of the garage. 2015 Range Rover Autobiography 4.4 SDV8

Post #636983 16th Jul 2022 12:12am
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JayGee



Member Since: 27 Jul 2021
Location: London
Posts: 3236

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Orkney Grey

Talk of cracked heads seems a bit premature. Nothing in those pics looks anything other than neglected oil servicing or the normal build up of deposits on high mileage engine esp one that has been used in an urban setting with lots of short trips. 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

Post #636989 16th Jul 2022 7:43am
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PeterRRVogue



Member Since: 22 Jan 2022
Location: Brackley
Posts: 72

United Kingdom 

Well, so the Block, Crank and the complete heads are with the machining shop now. The guy (owner) did some preliminary checks when I brought the engine in and gave me 50-70% chance of being able to save the block and the crank (the chap seemed to have years of experience behind his belt). The crank had a bit of a bend 4 - 6 -8 thou from the overheat so it's 50:50 really. Also the big end and the Main journal on the first two pistons were difficult to tell if they can be fixed within the spec without him having a go at it first. So while I'm waiting for any updates from the machining shop, I'm going to be busy, having both turbos reconditioned, injectors checked / remanufactured, fixing the rust on the subframe (easy access without the engine in) and outsourcing missing parts.


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Post #637305 19th Jul 2022 11:17am
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PeterRRVogue



Member Since: 22 Jan 2022
Location: Brackley
Posts: 72

United Kingdom 

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Engine bits delivery Smile

Post #637307 19th Jul 2022 11:21am
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JayGee



Member Since: 27 Jul 2021
Location: London
Posts: 3236

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Orkney Grey

Did he pass judgement on the cause - oil starvation? 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

Post #637308 19th Jul 2022 11:26am
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PeterRRVogue



Member Since: 22 Jan 2022
Location: Brackley
Posts: 72

United Kingdom 

The bearing span due to oil starvation (i guess this was obvious even to me), in terms of why the oil slugged up like that, most likely no oil change in combination with a wrong oil. Regardless he will check the block and pressure test the heads to make sure there is nothing hiding in there..

Post #637311 19th Jul 2022 12:02pm
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