just wondering why engines dont get routinely flushed when the oils changed .... a lot of engines go on for miles and miles on just oil changes and i cant see gearboxs being different........ .... ... - .- -.




Y. O. L. O.
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Unnecessary quote removed

LR don't suggest it because they can then claim lower maintenace costs and it reduces outlay for dealers on the flushing machines, but even then, I still don't think that's much logical justification at all (and there's certainly no moral justification). They can probably make more money selling a filter, pan and labour at extortionate prices. Very few failures are likely to occur within the warranty period, and so it's "not their problem".

The machines are designed to ensure equal amounts of oil come out and go in (though the level should still be checked afterwards), with more than the entire oil capacity being used in the process - something like 11 or 12 litres.

My flush cost under £300 done on my drive. A simple change is quite cheap also; it's when the pan and filter are changed that the cost goes up, which means if that isn't needed yet, costs are kept down.

Stan, engines don't retain anywhere near as much oil when a simple change is done. Oil in an engine also provides lubrication alone, in a transmission it is used to provide the friction drive and pumped through the valve blocks to control the transmission as well as lubricating it all.

 Visiting from DISCO3.CO.UK
Discovery 3 TDV6 Auto HSE Zambezi Silver

What i can’t understand is the “not changing the filter” thing... Clearly from the picture on the page before (and from my own cutting open a plastic sump) the filter is intact a filter! Not a metal gauze type strainer so clearly should be changed...

As Emirates said above and i think is clear for all to see! Megaflushing will have a benefit over a simple fluid change. But why NOT change the filter? The transmission has been built with a serviceable filter. JLR have the filter on their service schedule! (Arguably service intervals are too long on most models) but the filter is still included everywhere else...

I can understand the time/financial implications on a D3 6SP as the gearbox member is in the way so servicing the filter is a right pain! But on a FF... Why do half a job??????

Anyway, thats my thoughts... Its unto individuals to make their own minds up on the “filter/strainer” change...

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Craig & all on this thread

I have had 30 mins to think about all this - what everyone been telling me & showing me:


What EVERY ONE IS REALLY SAYING:

IS DONT GET LR TO SERVICE YOUR VEHICLE - AS THEY ARE NOT DOING A DECENT JOB - AND LEADING YOU UP A GARDEN PATH WITH
" WE HAVE SERVICED / CHANGED YOUR GEAR BOX OIL - AND IT WILL BE £ 700.00 Sir "
Oh Its my hard earned money too !

Its Nuts !!!! - Im I wasting my money ?


Who ever started this thread - I think it was Craig - WELL DONE
You have me really thinking - when I buy my next LR405 - will I take it to the dealers ? properly not.



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That's true, on a FF it is going to be easier, but the main thing is circumstances. If it's at 150k, then the filter may or may not be worth doing, but if we're talking about a preventitive flush at 50-75k on a healthy box, then it will achieve nothing but waste fresh oil and add a little labour. Basically, the filter is only going to be "dirty" if the box has already screwed itself and needs more attention, so if the flush does the trick, there's no need to go further at that point.

I shall indeed be changing my filter and pan some time (probably not at 150k but some time between then and 200k) because like you, it's something I would always do, but I wouldn't bother with it at earlier preventitive stages, that's all.

 Visiting from DISCO3.CO.UK
Discovery 3 TDV6 Auto HSE Zambezi Silver

stan wrote:

just wondering why engines dont get routinely flushed when the oils changed .... a lot of engines go on for miles and miles on just oil changes and i cant see gearboxs being different........ ....

Because the dry capacity of an engine is very, very similar to the service capacity

As previously stated, a gearbox drain/refill replaces 4.5 litres, and the dry capacity is 12 litres (approx)

You wouldn't drain only a third of your engine oil out on a service

Cam-Tech-Craig wrote:

I can understand the time/financial implications on a D3 6SP as the gearbox member is in the way so servicing the filter is a right pain! But on a FF... Why do half a job??????

Anyway, thats my thoughts... Its unto individuals to make their own minds up on the “filter/strainer” change...

Lost for Words wrote:

That's true, on a FF it is going to be easier, but the main thing is circumstances. If it's at 150k, then the filter may or may not be worth doing, but if we're talking about a preventitive flush at 50-75k on a healthy box, then it will achieve nothing but waste fresh oil and add a little labour. Basically, the filter is only going to be "dirty" if the box has already screwed itself and needs more attention, so if the flush does the trick, there's no need to go further at that point.

I shall indeed be changing my filter and pan some time (probably not at 150k but some time between then and 200k) because like you, it's something I would always do, but I wouldn't bother with it at earlier preventitive stages, that's all.

So from that way of thinking LFW, if the engine oil is still clean (on say a petrol or LPG powered car) there would be NO benefit in changing the engine oil filter at service point?

The engine oil is exposed to the products of combustion; the ATF is not.  Visiting from DISCO3.CO.UK
Discovery 3 TDV6 Auto HSE Zambezi Silver

As an aside , I had new sump/filter put on my car and did a couple of drain/refills .
When my car went on for its brake hose recall I asked about a flush .
A "double flush" with lifeguard takes 3-4 hours and costs $800 .
Not a bad price considering the cost of the fluid and time plus inconvenience for me to carry on draining , so I booked it in ...

Then they old me I had an oil drip from the new sump and they would have to fit a new one .
$1200 if I remember !!
I asked if they could just tighten the bolts , and they told me they couldn't
They cannot "repair" anything , and can only fit new parts due to future warranty implications !!!


Anyway , my opinion ..
The flush is nothing more than a time-saver for people doing the gradual drain/refil procedure .
The first step when starting the drain/fill routine should be a filter , so this too should be the first step when doing a flush .

If I were in the uk , I'd drive to a Zf service center in Germany .
They Refurb the valve block and fit upgraded parts as part of their service and it only costs around €350 !!!

" If I were in the uk , I'd drive to a Zf service center in Germany .
They Refurb the valve block and fit upgraded parts as part of their service"

any details of where and linkeys so we can explore this?

I'm on my iPhone out on site , but will get you info as soon as I get back to the office .

In the meantime , you can look of zf site for service centers .
They also have lots of good info on there to download

This ZF service centre is not far from Calais....

http://artec59.fr/zf/

And nearest full ZF Centre in Germany (4hrs 46m from Calais)

http://www.editus.lu/de/zf-friedrichshafen...ken-761901

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Calais,+...4736?hl=en

Last edited by Gazellio @ Prestige Cars on 9th Feb 2016 6:03pm. Edited 2 times in total

Is it worth getting this done on the S/C gearbox?

I can see the arguments on both sides but look at it this way, any engine or gearbox filter works one way, oil goes through it one way and the oil gets filtered removing bits of the combustion process in an engine, like carbon, and bits of the torque converter and clutches in an auto box. the filters are made so that even if neglected and used in extreme conditions they don't block up, they have a massive built in safety margin....

So flushing or draining the oil won't run oil through it backwards so no particles will escape into the new oil.

Not changing the filter will probably do no long term harm to the gearbox at all, I imagine missing one engine oil filter change would make little difference to the longevity of the engine either...

The places that do a megaflush probably realise that it makes little difference so don't bother to go through all the hassle to change the filter...

Having said all that I'm firmly with Craig, anything at all I can do to help the fatty stay in top condition I will do, I'd much rather over service than hope it will all be OK...

So the additional cost of a filter replacement is for piece of mind and the knowledge that you can't do any more.. Well worth it IMHO.... Pete
I now have permission from the boss to use Y.O.L.O. Enjoy life
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