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winco



Member Since: 12 Feb 2024
Location: Dorset
Posts: 40

United Kingdom 
ZF 6 speed box loses drive after a few seconds

ZF 6 speed in my 5.0 S/C.
Gearbox drained and fresh fluid.

The gearbox will now engage in D or R but after a few seconds it will lose drive. I stop, switch off and wait 5 minutes, and drive is restored for a few seconds and then lost again. Rinse and repeat.

I have checked the fluid level. Gearbox sump temperature 32°C via an IR thermometer and engine running; small trickle.

Sometimes, when returning to P from D or R, I hear a springy gear trying to engage sound.

Anyone any ideas? 2010 5.0 SC Autobiography Overfinch in Bentley Silk White pearlescent, 22" Overfinch wheels with 285/35x22 tyres

Post #710173 25th Jan 2025 4:36pm
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RRPhil



Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 980

United Kingdom 

Quote:
Sometimes, when returning to P from D or R, I hear a springy gear trying to engage sound.

This could be your park lock pawl ratcheting against its gear, which implies that the transmission output shaft is still turning when you are selecting Park. This can only happen (assuming the vehicle is stationary) if there’s some kind of disconnect downstream of the transmission e.g. transfer box, propshafts, final drives or driveshafts.
I would raise the vehicle on its suspension and get someone to look underneath to see if they can see a propshaft or driveshaft turning while you are stationary with D or R selected (obviously, for safety’s sake, they need to be to the side of the vehicle and not underneath it).
Another possibility is that the transmission output shaft spline has failed through fretting corrosion due to lack of lubrication.

Phil

Post #710177 25th Jan 2025 5:05pm
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GraemeS



Member Since: 06 Mar 2015
Location: Wagga area
Posts: 2555

Australia 2012 Range Rover Autobiography TDV8 Bournville

I had my MY12's output shaft splines re-lubricated at 150K kms. The grease was rather dry but the splines weren't worn at all.

Post #710187 25th Jan 2025 7:53pm
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winco



Member Since: 12 Feb 2024
Location: Dorset
Posts: 40

United Kingdom 

RRPhil wrote:
Quote:
Sometimes, when returning to P from D or R, I hear a springy gear trying to engage sound.

This could be your park lock pawl ratcheting against its gear, which implies that the transmission output shaft is still turning when you are selecting Park. This can only happen (assuming the vehicle is stationary) if there’s some kind of disconnect downstream of the transmission e.g. transfer box, propshafts, final drives or driveshafts.
I would raise the vehicle on its suspension and get someone to look underneath to see if they can see a propshaft or driveshaft turning while you are stationary with D or R selected (obviously, for safety’s sake, they need to be to the side of the vehicle and not underneath it).
Another possibility is that the transmission output shaft spline has failed through fretting corrosion due to lack of lubrication.

Phil


That is it. On older, non electronic auto boxes, you could get this sound if you were too quick selecting park without fully stopping first.

On mine, this sound happens if the engine revs are elevated and I select P after being in D or R having lost drive.

What I don't understand is the repeatable scenario of engaged D or R and being able to move and then it is as if N has been selected and it is like this until I switch off and wait 5 minutes. Selecting manual shift makes no difference.

I did refill the box via an oil cooler line (because I was parked on a slope). After getting onto a level and being nerdy with a spirit level, I realised I had about 1 litre too much oil in.

Have I messed up something with (a) filling via a cooler line , or (b) having a litre too much? 2010 5.0 SC Autobiography Overfinch in Bentley Silk White pearlescent, 22" Overfinch wheels with 285/35x22 tyres

Post #710192 25th Jan 2025 8:47pm
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GraemeS



Member Since: 06 Mar 2015
Location: Wagga area
Posts: 2555

Australia 2012 Range Rover Autobiography TDV8 Bournville

Worn-out fine splines will often grip momentarily, possibly before there's much load on the connection.

Post #710195 25th Jan 2025 9:59pm
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winco



Member Since: 12 Feb 2024
Location: Dorset
Posts: 40

United Kingdom 

I got my son to sit in the car, foot on the brake and select D and rev slightly. I could see the front driveshaft, from the transfer box to the front diff spinning. However, the left right driveshafts from the front diff to the front wheels were stationary.

My son then selected rock crawling mode and was able to move the car, presumably where the diffs are locked and it was the rear diff giving drive.

I don't understand why the front diff has failed. I know I refilled it with oil after putting the engine back in. 2010 5.0 SC Autobiography Overfinch in Bentley Silk White pearlescent, 22" Overfinch wheels with 285/35x22 tyres

Post #711148 5th Feb 2025 6:26pm
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Dtech



Member Since: 29 Nov 2014
Location: Yorkshire Dales
Posts: 66

England 2011 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Santorini Black

The stationary shaft may have moved out and disengaged with the splines.

Post #711149 5th Feb 2025 6:41pm
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winco



Member Since: 12 Feb 2024
Location: Dorset
Posts: 40

United Kingdom 

The part number for my diff is LR010798. For availability the 3.6 diesel appears to have the same diff part number, but the 4.4 diesel doesn't. 2010 5.0 SC Autobiography Overfinch in Bentley Silk White pearlescent, 22" Overfinch wheels with 285/35x22 tyres

Post #711150 5th Feb 2025 6:43pm
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winco



Member Since: 12 Feb 2024
Location: Dorset
Posts: 40

United Kingdom 

Dtech wrote:
The stationary shaft may have moved out and disengaged with the splines.


My part number message crossed with yours.

Thank you. Can you elaborate? By stationary shaft, would that be the pinion onto the crown wheel?

If it has moved out and disengaged, is that terminal, or can it 'be put back'?

Sorry, I am on a fast learning curve. (I have rebuilt a rear diff in a Jeep in the past.) 2010 5.0 SC Autobiography Overfinch in Bentley Silk White pearlescent, 22" Overfinch wheels with 285/35x22 tyres

Post #711151 5th Feb 2025 6:50pm
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RRPhil



Member Since: 22 Aug 2011
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire
Posts: 980

United Kingdom 

winco wrote:
For availability the 3.6 diesel appears to have the same diff part number, but the 4.4 diesel doesn't.

https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/post699868.html#699868

Phil

Post #711152 5th Feb 2025 7:11pm
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Dtech



Member Since: 29 Nov 2014
Location: Yorkshire Dales
Posts: 66

England 2011 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Santorini Black

winco wrote:
Dtech wrote:
The stationary shaft may have moved out and disengaged with the splines.


My part number message crossed with yours.

Thank you. Can you elaborate? By stationary shaft, would that be the pinion onto the crown wheel?

If it has moved out and disengaged, is that terminal, or can it 'be put back'?

Sorry, I am on a fast learning curve. (I have rebuilt a rear diff in a Jeep in the past.)


Check the distance between the diff housing and the inner half shaft UJ on each side. The shafts have been known to move out and disengage with the splines in the diff. This could cause lack of drive to the front wheels.if this is the case, As I recall it can be levered back in with a decent sized pry bar

Post #711157 5th Feb 2025 8:00pm
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