Lengthy post alert…

Hi folks! Long time lurker and first post, as I’m looking to join the gang and would like a bit/a lot of advice please?

Here’s where I’m at…
I’ve a requirement for a vehicle with a 3.5t towing capability for a large covered trailer that’s just arrived for my Lotus that I track day - approx 5-7 times a year. Said vehicle would also need to be a reliable daily for approx 10/12k miles a year. Mix of driving would likely be longer journeys (once a week to the office - 50 miles), towing to TDs, and the odd supermarket run to the nearest town 3-4 miles. We do have an A3 we tend to do shorter runs in.

Initially I’d ruled out a RR on the basis of reliability, and was looking for a Touareg or X5. Whilst I’m handy-ish with spanner’s, I don’t have the emotional or cognitive capacity to have both the Lotus and a daily RR in bits. I do have a couple of specialists within the local-ish area. It can’t be leaving me stranded either on my way to a client meeting, in the middle of no where with a trailer & car on the back, or worse so, break down when my Mrs is on her own.

Budget circa £25K. My initial thinking was to find a nice L322 comfortably less then the max budget ~£15K and spend the rest as a slush fund on potential maintenance/self warranty. However like all these things, scope creep kicks in and cheaper L405s are falling into the top end of the budget.

It’s got to be the V8 diesel - a V8 Range Rover is very much a bucket list car.

So, based on my requirements above, should I stick to an L322? Are they getting a touch too old to be used daily etc? Would I be asking for trouble looking at earlier L405s? I’d read up that pre-2015 models can have electrical issues? Is there an easy way to identify which L405s have these issues resolved (other than looking for a certain year?)

Vehicle mileage doesn’t bother me, as I tend to buy based on history and condition, assuming it’s priced accordingly. I don’t mind bills and appreciate any car could let me down, I just don’t want to put myself in a position where I’m asking for trouble.

Collective wisdom of the Range Rover world - What’s your advice please?

Jamie

Your budget should get a really good condition MY 10-12 4.4 TDV8
For me the extra money for the L405 doesn’t get you much more “car” over the L322…and in my view gets you less “Range Rover”.
London prices of non ULEZ diesels are becoming very cheap.
My suggestion would be to head to London…buy an L322 on condition

The six million dollar question l405 l322 you are always going to get biased opinions on what we drive I had an l322 bought it with 150000 on the clock and all that I remember going on it was the serpentine belt other than that proved reliable. I only changed because of the low emission zones popping up here and there so changed to my current 2016 l405 which I love,had it since march and already I have covered 13000 miles of trouble free motoring
Both have been 4.4 v8 diesel’s economical wise the 405 is slightly better due to being lighter
Which would I have given the choice………….afraid to say the 405
Your choice. Always have a reserve fund no matter which one you get
Enjoy the search  2016 4.4 diesel

For that budget I'd go for an L322. £20k for a mint low miler and £5k as a contingency fund. £25k seems a bit low for a 'sorted' L405. 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

Irrespective of the othe comparisons, would the L322 tow better with it being a bit heavier?

Seem to remember a thread somewhere…….

 2011 Range Rover Vogue SE 4.4 TDV8

Previous cars :
2003 Range Rover Vogue TD6
1999 Discovery Td5 ES
1995 BMW M5 3.8 6 speed
1992 Range Rover 3.9 Efi Vogue
1992 BMW M5 3.8
1988 BMW 735i SE
1989 Ford Sierra XR4x4 2.9i
1981 Ford Fiesta Supersport

Just popped up - nice SDV8 for sale £20k

https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic68382.html

Regarding the towing issue, again all subjective. I have an L322 and an L405, IMHO the 322 tows better (1.5T horse box and 2.5T loaded), the 405 is not in anyway bad though, just doesn't feel as solid, which may be me not really gelling with the 405 and my wife loving it  2013 L405 Autobiography Baltic Blue
2007 L322 Vogue Buckingham Blue

pcourtney wrote:

Just popped up - nice SDV8 for sale £20k

https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic68382.html

There you go. Problem solved.  2016 4.4 diesel

Thanks for the help folks, it’s very much appreciated!

Hadn’t thought of the difference in towing between the models. Rosco - my setup isn’t far off the weight of your ‘oss, so that’s valuable feedback.

I’m out the country for another week so it gives me plenty of time to mull over and make a short list. It seems you’ve validated what I thought that, based on my budget, a 4.4 L322 plus contingency funds is the best route forward.

I just couldn’t shake the feeling I was maybe going to over stretch myself on an early L405 only to regret it later down the line.

On the subject of the later 4.4 L322s, could anyone please share details of what to look out for/check when going to look at one? Assume this has been asked a million times so any links to other threads would be great please.

Thanks again for the help!

IMO you've just got to be lucky (or more specifically not unlucky). I've had 4 over 16 years. The first was a nightmare, second an angel, third excellent until it suddenly wasn't (end of year 4), and fourth all good so far. You're more likely to get a good one than a bad one, particularly if you select well - but in the end that's where you need to not be unlucky.

For your needs, I can see the oil burner makes some sense. But I'm a petrolhead (and Lotus fan boy!) and much prefer the petrol ones (over the TDV8 variants which are the only two I've tried). They all tow well. I tow an open car trailer several times a year (prob 2.5 tons loaded) and a plant trailer (similar laden weight) so little experience of 3.5 ton but there is absolutely no problem with those lighter loads.

L322 or L405 - Depends which elements of ownership you're going to prioritise. The L322 being heavier feels less different went towing - eg when towing an empty trailer its easy to forget its even there! Its also more of a gentleman's club type of environment - great presence, hugely capable, unruffled...but bordering on sedate as an overall dynamic feel - you're always aware its a big old barge. The L405 is a much better driver's car (when not towing) being lighter and better handling in most situations without ever forgetting its role as the ultimate SUV. Either one will prove just a lovely place to be, particularly on the long runs. Good luck with the search... Mike - MPx

2017 5.0 V8 Supercharged SVAutobigraphy Dynamic SVO Palette Grey (2021-...)
2012 5.0 V8 Supercharged Autoboigraphy Orkney Grey (2017-2021)
2007 4.2 V8 Supercharged Vogue SE Tonga Green (2012-2017)
2002 4.4 V8 Vogue Bonnatti Grey (2008-2012)

Oil coolers tend to leak, you can fit new gaskets but replacement is normally the best option. Rev it over 2,500 so second turbo kicks in and look for smoke…second turbo as standard doesn’t have a oil drain so it can build up then needs burnt off…they don’t all do it, mine didn’t then started! A oil drain mod is available at circa £1,000. Starter motors often fail, not easily spotted till they are going then you get a click as solenoid doesn’t click in a bit like a poor battery.
Can rust on rear arches and top tailgate.
Usual bushes and suspension parts…they are a heavy car.
I’ve spent circa £6k sorting mine in last four and a bit years…see my for sale ad! 2012 tdv8 Westminster arrived Jan 19 gone Dec 23

200 TDi discovery bobtail gone
RR classic v8 bobtail gone
300 tdi Discovery 3 dr gone

I can´t comment on the L405, but I´m 5 years into running a ´12 4.4 TDV8 L322, it's used for everything. Trips up to the folks in the Pyrenees, supermarket runs, towing, airport runs everything in between and it's been fabulous. DPF warning light came on once in that time, but that was due to COVID lockdowns and simply not being able to run the car enough during the winter.

I´m very hot on preventative maintenance, so whilst the other half thinks I throw a fortune at our Westie, (and I do) it's not because it's gone wrong - I like to keep ahead.

In 5 years we´ve had 1 major problem (car incapacitated) the original battery gave up the ghost. Other than that, it's been very plain sailing. Normal servicing and maintenance items. We are probably nudging 120k now.

The only thing I can think of to look for is the oil cooler leaking - they all seem to eventually—lots of chatter about it here on the forum. I did it myself, but most seem to pay 1,000+ GBP to get it done professionally.

Good luck! 2012 4.4 TDV8 Westminster - Baltic Blue, Jet interior
1997 P38 2.5 DSE auto & 1998 P38 2.5 DT Manual
1988 Vogue 3.5 EFI - Manual, gone.
2004 Volvo C70 2.0T convertible, had since new.
2007 Mazda MX-5 2.0 Sport Roadster/Coupé, had since new.
2024 Mini Cooper S cabrio, JCW kit, 2.0, DCT auto

A lot of your decision between L322 and L405 comes down to personal opinion. The L322 obviously went out of production in 2012 so they arecgetting on in years. For me, I wanted an L322 as a bucket list car and whilevi know the L405vis probably a more luxurious and better on road offering, there is something more traditional and analogue about the older model.
Last January I travelled to buy a late 2012 Westinster with 53k miles and I haven't regretted it. If anything, I prefer the relaxed driving mood it creates as opposed to my F10 M5. It's also considerably more economical than the M5.

Take a look at the for sale section on here as there is both an L405 which has been highlighted to you as well as an L322 which looks like a great car. Good luck with whatever decision that you make.

There's always strong support for the L322 - and I've had several, but I prefer the L405 in almost every way. I've towed with both fairly regularly and I couldn't really tell the difference, they are both great tow cars.

The one advertised further up this thread looks great value IMHO. You'd need to budget something over £1k for a tow bar - they are far from cheap (or this one if you're handy with spanners)


Then again, there's an L322 for sale that would leave you a lot of change - and already has a to bar....
https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic68370.html

Comparing a 322 to a 405 gets interesting answers as there are serious advocates of both. I would compare it to Star Trek: Its a bit like the Original Series vs The Next Generation.

A purist fan would often go for TOS even if its a bit creaky and dated, but anyone who watched both with an open mind would accept that TNG was a lot smoother and more polished.

Anyway, whilst Im bleedin miles away, I'm shortly about to put up for sale my 13 plate Autobiography SDV8 with 97k miles (and a towbar) for £18k.

Selling on the basis that my Dutch employers have decided that if I have an EV I can claim literally everything back from the company, which is maths thats hard to argue with.