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PaulM



Member Since: 08 Mar 2015
Location: Warwickshire
Posts: 190

United Kingdom 2003 Range Rover Autobiography 4.4 V8 Java Black
Where is this oil leak from in the valley pan? Video

Is this my mysterious oil leak? Coming from the valley pan?

I've had an oil leak I've been finding hard to track down, done a few other leaks so far but never cured it. Also changed PCV valve as I had oil spew out the back of it onto the road like possessed demon!

After trying to remove the water pump today it's revealing more bodge jobs from previous owners. Literally everything so far has been glued or sealed with RTV silicone and trying to pull off the water pump pulled off the coolant pipes as they had been siliconed on and the pump had no gasket just more RTV.

Now though I can see loads of oil in the valley pan area and I have a feeling this is where my mysterious oil leak has been coming from. Can anybody shed any light on what might be causing it? I always thought you only got coolant leaks here from the valley pan gasket.

This is a video of inside the valley pan




 2004 RR 4.4 V8 Autobiography

Post #397950 27th Jul 2016 4:26pm
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2035

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

from experience with the valley pan, (gasket) i noticed, that when i did the job, i had to remove the inlet manifold again, to do the valley pan seal again, as it failed, (another story there) but, i noticed, that the inlet to head joints, are sealed with four orange 'binocular shaped' gaskets. i changed these, but on susequent removal, i noticed that small amount of oil had leaked from inlet chamber, to he joint surface. the old ones were in good condition, but no doubt 'hardened' from heat. (and were letting by)
so, its likely that that oil mess on the valley, is from the typical high milage crankcase 'oil smoke' being drawn through the inlet, (as per design) but weepeing through the inlet to head seals.
My engine, (165k) had a fair amount of oil on the underside of the inlet manifold, and some grotty goo in the troughs next to the head and block area, mainly from the leaking coolant, boiled down to neat anti-freeze mixed with oil and dust.
to remove the inlet manifold, is not hard, but i think the gaskets are about £18 each, x4 but check first
i might be just as easy to live with it, knowing its not gonna kill your engine.
if you havent done your valley seal, then do it at this opportunity. i will update my previous valley pan repair comments in another thread, as i would only recommend changing the actuall valley pan, and not resealing with RTV, as it failed!

Post #397998 28th Jul 2016 8:24am
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PaulM



Member Since: 08 Mar 2015
Location: Warwickshire
Posts: 190

United Kingdom 2003 Range Rover Autobiography 4.4 V8 Java Black

I did wonder about those orange seals, it needs to be sorted as I have drip all over the sump etc. Maybe I should do rocker gaskets too while I have the inlet off. What do you do about the valley pan gasket then? Can you actually buy a gasket? 2004 RR 4.4 V8 Autobiography

Post #398162 28th Jul 2016 10:57pm
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2035

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

if you have weeping rocker cover gaskets, then start there! that is by far an easier job. you change the inner and outer rocker gaskets. fairly easy, you might want to change your plugs at same time, and investigate the plugwells filled up with oil. (normal!) you should soak up as much oil with dry rag, and then unscrew each plug, with a decent reaching plug socket. taking care to hold the extension straight. -if plug wells are dry, spray in some Plusgas to penetrate the threads as they bake themselves in. with all that done, clean up your covers area, and monitor etc. as this stopped my leaks, running down side of engine, and onto steering rack etc.
Should you go further, you would need to get the four orange gaskets, and a valley pan cover. and a pair of rear water jacket Y piece gaskets, plus all four O rings for the water pipes. its a rotten job, reaching down the rear of engine to get the y piece off, but its easier (to me) than taking all the front radiator area to get the water pump off. i think, what might be happenning on these engines, is a combination of hardenened gaskets, slowly weeping oil. the orange ones, no doubt are weeping a little. as oil inside the inlet, dribbles down, and weeps out. but, that would only restrict oil mess, to the centre engine area, not the sides.
if you are not losing water, (slowly) -then you have no need to remove the valley pan cover. -so, you would only need to remove inlet mani. and change all four orange gaskets, and replace. (much easier) -for that, you remove the 8 plug coils, and yank off the injector harnesses, and fold back. then, remove about 12 nuts, and sleeves, and, with PCV hoses still on, lift at front, and observe underneath the gaskets. you can take it off if you de-hose it at rear. note, there is a very small plastic pipe underneath, at fed from rear, on inlet, it goes brittle. mine broke, so i plugged the hole... there is also the slightly thicker front to back air vaccuum pipe. -then, when cleaning the valley area, plug all inlet ports with paper towel! if you have dropped any nut, or tool whilst removing the inlet, do not lift it till its recovered, it can fall into an inlet port, and then the trouble starts!

Post #398176 29th Jul 2016 6:50am
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PaulM



Member Since: 08 Mar 2015
Location: Warwickshire
Posts: 190

United Kingdom 2003 Range Rover Autobiography 4.4 V8 Java Black

Well thank you for all that info, a very big help Very Happy Thing with this car is it had a list of problems as long as my arm when I bought it so I'm giving this car a mini overhaul. One problem is a coolant leak, hence why I'm changing the rad and water pump. If you look at my other post you will see what I'm changing, this list is getting longer though! I've also been chasing an oil leak since day one, which I feel is quite bad even for a Land Rover. That oil round the inlet in the valley is definitely running down the center of the block and round the water pump from the valley area so it must be quite bad to do that. I also have one on the right side of the block as you look from the front. Rocker gaskets don't seem to have any oil drips that I can see or feel though which lead to think maybe upper timing chain cover. I've been thinking about buying that cylinder head gasket set from island4x4 for £80 and just doing the lot. Then what about the valley pan? Is there a gasket or do you need to buy the valley pan itself with gasket already on it from island4x4 £30? Also the water jacket Y piece you talked about, is that the part at the back under the inlet that those alloy water pipes push into direct from the water pump? 2004 RR 4.4 V8 Autobiography

Post #398191 29th Jul 2016 8:14am
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johnboyairey



Member Since: 11 Jan 2013
Location: surrey
Posts: 2035

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

yes, if you have a water leak, then use this thread i have posted on to see the american guy do the job on a BMW he uses the RTV method, i would now recommend using a new cover, with built in new (harder) bead applied already. http://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic33408-45.html

its a big job, to change it, but only need a basic socket set. when reading that thread, read about the area where the valley leaks onto, ie the back of the valley, and down the rear of the engine block, and out by the join to the gearbox.
i have some pictures i need to upload to that thread to complete my 'tale'. if i can find them!
Those rocker gaskets are notorious for leaks. they go rock hard. and are quite cheap and easy to do. if the inner ones leak, they fill up the plug wells with oil. to get the upper timing chain covers off, you do that with the rocker covers off, and replace the rubber gaskets there too. but the lower timing cover, is a massive job. as you need to get the crank pulley nut off, -and a special made up tool is needed. so dont get too ambitious. you could do no wrong, by getting it steam cleaned? ive done mine a couple of times, withtthe engine, warmed and cooled for half an hour. this, (in summer weather,) allows the engine to dry off, quickly. you might then see your fresh oil leak, emerging. -easier to see with existing dirty oil though.
all these engines are suffering similar leaks. but they are a great engine. -when you have the rocker cover off, look how clean and 'unclogged' everthing is.

Post #398251 29th Jul 2016 12:44pm
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