What do people think, support on the strikes?

Do people think that those who signed up for such pensions and benefits should recieve what they signed up for and were promised and that only new joiners to such professions should get a worse deal that is better for the government or not?

I for one support them striking. My wife is a teacher, has type 1 diabetes and with the current stress of the job may end up having to take ill healther retirement within 10 years but under the current proposals would be screwed out of what she signed up for. She has to pay more contirbutions and has taken a pay cut already, as well as the schools already having strained budgets. So effectively she has had 2 pay cuts however they want to cut it, and then they want to take more money from her working so hard. She spends about 9hours in the place, then comes home and spends at least 2-3hrs per night working, and often 8hours a day at the weekends/bank hols and holiday times. Yes she gets lots of holidays as you term them, but she still ends up having to work 80% of them. This year she had 3 weeks off in total this summer. Thats less than most private sector jobs when its factored in. Oh and she has to pay to a union as a mandatory, not optional thing as well so more money taken out.

If i worked the same hours in my job the OT over the basic would have me earning well in excess of what she is on and allow a much better pensions/benefits scheme.

Its not like she submits any expenses, very rarely has she ever claimed for any bits of kit/resources that she has had to buy to enable her to teach. The classroom still has blooming CRT's and 15yr old desktops in it!
I dont think she has ever claimed for any houses for ducks or chickens or a 2nd home that she has then rented out!

All these cuts so far have netted the gov what? Further debt, another £120bn or such figure alone this year?

She does the job because she loves it and is ruddy marvelous at it. She and others like her are helping prop the government up and ensure that people have half a brain when they leave school so get a half decent job and put more dosh into the coffers of the gov that then gets wasted.

Its typical of big orgs/enterprises as well. The worker bee's do 99% of the work yet account for 1% of the payscale

Yeah I think all teachers who work 9-5, have 8 week holidays, gold plated pensions, and way above average pay should strike ... in fact lets give them all a 10% pay rise ... lets listen to Ed Ball and borrow some more money to pay for it?

I dont know any teachers who work 9-5 and actually get 8 weeks holiday other than the lazy unprofessional ones!

As above if my wife actually got 8 weeks off we would save a fortune, as it is she doesn't so we still end up paying for childcare and associated costs.

Gold plated pension, hmm if you work hard your whole life building up literally 1000's of kids intelligence to get them ready to put more money in the coffers paying your wages, and pay into it for that facter as well(circa 30%).

I haven't had a pay rise for a few years now as i work for an MOD contractor i know its not going to happen for a long time yet but i pay my tax's in the vain hope it actually makes the country and its gov paid workforce stronger, not weaker.

Add to that the fact she earns less than me yet is more qualified and experienced in her respected field i fail to see how they are paid way above what they should for such jobs. And yes this is excluding the levels of middle management and above which as has been stated by countles press reports, increased massively year on year compared to the lower workforce.

King I agree with you 10000000%. My wife is also a teacher and she doesn't get paid anywhere near enough for what she does! She has been off for 6weeks now after having 2 operations on her feet, but in that time when she has been signed off by a doctor (not self cert) she has been doing school work to help the other teachers. An as for the holidays she never gets this time off properly as she has to prep for the new term etc, not to mention having to take family holidays at the most expensive times of the year. .
My sister is a A&E doctor has spent a long time training and she works worse hours than my wife, granted she gets paid more but again isn't paid what she deserves! The whole system takes the and makes my blood boil when people start saying they shouldn't be fighting for what the deserve! [img]http://www.fuelly.com/driver/rob2529/range-rover[img/]
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I'll be striking on Wednesday and although I would rather not be I feel I have to stand up for my future. I'm only 31 and if they makes the proposed changes I guarantee it won't be the last. By the time I reach retirement age I'll be an old man with feck all left to give and my pension will prob be next to worthless anyway.
Those that signed up to the pension as it is, should have it left that way. All new staff can be offered the new deal. Not many people know that the NHS pensions were already altered 3-4 years ago generally making them worse for staff paying in. This got no media coverage and kinda just happened.
For me the blame for these strikes and the impact it has falls firmly at the feet of the government. I doubt any of them will have any financial worries when they retire in their mid 50s! FFRR TD6 HSE
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Striking is thoroughly unprofessional, it is actually unauthorised absence, and it warrants a written warning.

Nobody so far has presented an argument as to why those working in the public sector deserve better pensions than those working in the private sector, especially when taxation which is paid by everyone is used to fund public sector pensions. It's grossly unfair and TBH, those going on strike need to take a reality check.

All I hear is a lot of bleating by those who stand to get brought closer to the real world, and if they all work so hard then howcome all our public services are in such a terrible state? Why is it that I was forced to pay for my kids' education 'cos all the schools in a 10 mile radius a so shockingly bad. Why is the health service in an ever decreasing spiral of crap despite receiving the most ever funding? Etcetera, Etcetera.

Privatise the friggin lot and see them strike then. They'd soon get sacked. Pay and rewards should be linked to results as they are in the private sector. And public money should not be used to bolster failing businesses in the private sector either, read BANKS.

It all makes my pi55 boil. Me and about 30 million other folks. Everyone I've heard speak of this has said pretty much the same thing, including teachers and at least one doctor (who's married to a teacher at my son's school)

If anything the proposals don't go anywhere near far enough. It should have been one pension system for the whole country. If you work and pay in then you get it, if you don't then you don't. Simple enough really.

Bear a thought for all those people who work in the private sector and look on in disbelief. Many will have NO employer contributing pension scheme and those that do have considerably less favourable terms. I have worked in both public and private sectors and can safely say I know which sector I would rather be in in terms of pension provision and employee protection.

I work at an independent school for disabled children - we cannot and would not strike over pay and conditions, our sense of duty and duty of care to the children just doesn't allow for it.

My wife is a nurse specialist in cancer in the NHS, she has a clinic on Wednesday. She'll be there because her duty is to her patients.

I've used the word duty a lot - many public sector workers seemed to have forgotten about why they are working in a public service......

My kids will miss a days teaching; my daughter who is doing her A levels is quite cross with her teachers for even contemplating striking.

Sorry, but there are better ways of dealing with this, blaming the government won't help, they are trying to sort out a mess this country hasn't seen for over 80 years without significantly increasing direct taxes. Economies thrive on people working, earning and spending, such a strike is bad for the economy as a whole and will just make life more difficult for everyone. .
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Its fairly simple. The country is skint and needs to save money in ALL areas. Someone will always lose out and feel hard done by, but unfortunately that's just tough . When my personal finances are tight I need to make decisions as to what will have to be cut back on. If not, I'll end up bankrupt and have nothing at all.

Given the level of spending and forecast increase if no changes are made, what would public sector workers suggest? What about future generations? Do you want them to pick up the tab so you can have a few extra quid in your pocket?

Everyone of working age needs to understand they will be impacted by the current economic climate. What about the poor first time buyers who bought a house in 2007 who got no help when prices were at the peak compared to those now who will most likely get more help and support? is that fair? No, but it's life and life ain't fair!

Stop whinging, get your head down and get on with it - that will send a far more powerful message and will get more support from the rest of the country than throwing out your dummy. If and when the country is in a better financial position you will get far more support for reimplementation of the benefits and pension rights when we can afford it.

Don't get me wrong, I do sympathize with the position you're in, but striking is absolutely and undeniably the wrong way to get your point across.

^^^^

Basically, if you are a public sector worker your boss is about to go bankrupt and is trying to do everything he can to save some sort of future for you.
If it were the private sector, there would be even bigger pay offs. Previously..
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Lay offs, pay freezes, reduction in benefits, loss of pension contributions. It's always the first thing that happens in the private sector when things get tough and is regarded as normal and sensible business practice to ensure long term company survival.

They're never easy, but the alternatives are even worse.

Interesting my children's primary school in Chorleywood is not striking and never has. They just get the heads down and get on with teaching the next generation of hard working non whinging tax payers to pay for those who think it is their right to be supported by others whatever the current economic circumstances..

Of course everybody appreciates the great job some people in the public sector do.

This idea however that they should be immunised from the effects of the global financial crisis, and new economic realities, and they should receive their final salary pensions, whatever the cost to the taxpayer, because they do a good job...

Well it's just an insult to the rest of us, and it's extremely selfish. Nobody enjoys recession, nearly everybody has to make sacrifices. Already the public sector workers are suffering less, the are less likely to have their hours cut back, less likely to be made redundant, and they have greater job security, than their equivalents in the private sector.

It really is quite simple, as a country we have to stop spending what we don't have. I know people say 'Cut back on international aid' but that's just evil isn't it- lets keep the high public sector pensions, and forget about the people dying of hunger! or stop wasting the billions we have to pay to the EU - nice idea in theory, but legally impossible, blame the last lot who made this the case, and are now bleating in support of the strikers!

Bottom line is, it's not easy facing economic realities, but it is essential, otherwise you just compound them. Range Rover-less at the moment - Pining!

Just for peoples information I have not been immune to the recession. I too pay more for everything and get paid less etc etc etc. I don't mind "getting my head down" and have done so ever since I started working. Also, don't forget the money the public sector workers pay into there pensions goes into the coffers to pay for all sorts of things that effect all that live in our country.

I think a moderator to close and delete this thread as I can only see it turning sour. FFRR TD6 HSE
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GregP wrote:

I think a moderator to close and delete this thread as I can only see it turning sour.

You may be right Greg, this is certainly an issue which will polarise opinions, and create a lot of controversy, but surely we are a reasonable lot, and able to have a civilised debate.

Just on one of your points, surely the point is, that what you pay into your pensions, goes to pay your pensions, and the proposed change is to ensure that you will be able to get out what you've paid in, plus whatever returns have been made on the money over time, rather than the current situation whereby you get paid out purely according to your final salary, regardless of what you've paid in?

Final salary pensions worked for a while, when stock markets were going up every year.

The real issue is that successive governments have operated the worlds largest ponzi scheme, spending money which should have been ring fenced for future pensions, and paying current pensions out of current contributions, which was OK whilst the baby boomers were working, but now they are beginning to retire, along with declines in investment return, has created a 'perfect storm'. Meaning our pension system, along with that of probably most developed countries, is fundamentally bankrupt, unless they reduce their liabilities.

It may not be right, or fair, but it's economic reality, and the only other way around it would be to massively increase income tax to pay out the higher amounts, which would lead to a very severe depression, loss of economic competitiveness, and rampant stagflation (inflation whilst the economy is in recession - the worst economic scenario apart from hyperinflation which could also result). Range Rover-less at the moment - Pining!