If the l405 doesn’t have an Ingenium engine ignore …. But thought might be interesting. Didn’t want to post original article for copyright reasons but is article from today.

Andrew

Attention Range Rover Owners: Could Your Vehicle Be at Risk?

An article published today in The Telegraph by Alex Robbins sheds light on a growing issue affecting owners of Jaguar and Land Rover vehicles equipped with the Ingenium diesel engine. This includes many Range Rover models.

A Jaguar F-Pace owner reported that what began as a diagnosed turbocharger failure escalated into a full engine replacement, costing £13,000. Despite the dealer offering a 15% goodwill discount, Jaguar Land Rover (JLR) itself declined to assist further, leaving the owner frustrated and out of pocket.

What’s the Problem?
According to specialists, the root cause lies in the premature dilution of engine oil due to diesel fuel seeping past the piston rings. This occurs during repeated active regenerations of the diesel particulate filter (DPF), likely because the filter isn’t reaching the necessary temperature to burn off accumulated particulates.

The diluted oil reduces lubrication, causing increased wear and eventually catastrophic failures, such as turbocharger or timing chain damage. When a turbo fails, debris can enter the engine, often necessitating a complete replacement or rebuild.

What Does This Mean for Range Rover Owners?
Many Range Rover models also use the Ingenium diesel engine, meaning this issue could affect you. If you experience problems with the DPF, turbocharger, or timing chain, it’s crucial to address them immediately to avoid further damage.

What Can You Do?
• Regular Maintenance: Ensure oil changes and DPF servicing are performed according to the manufacturer’s guidelines.
• Stay Informed: Monitor your vehicle for any signs of engine trouble, such as reduced performance, unusual noises, or warning lights.
• Advocate for Support: If faced with a similar situation, consider escalating your case with JLR, as other affected owners have done.

As this issue becomes more widely reported, owners are encouraged to share their experiences to highlight the scale of the problem and push for a resolution from JLR. If you’ve encountered similar problems with your Range Rover or Jaguar, it might be worth exploring whether this underlying issue is at fault. --
On my third Full Fat RR
there's nothing like it.

Been there got the tee shirt!!

That’s the exact cause of the engine failure on my Sport. Went at 58k miles
£12k for a new engine, luckily in my case £10k covered by an RAC warranty.

Service intervals are 20k or 2 years.
Been advised if I keep it, to at least change the oil and filter every 6 months.

That’s a 2.0ltr 4 cylinder ingenium engine, found mainly in Disco Sports and Evoques but has found its way in to other models.

Hundreds if not thousands of failed engine examples out there.

For a brand that’s already infamous for its reliability record they really know how to fan the flames with some of their offerings.

The 405 (along with all other JLR models) is fitted with the Ingenium lump. On paper, it's a fantastic engine, offset crank, variable flow water and oil pumps, all in the search of improved efficiency

In practice, its a truly woeful engine that was rushed out, with substandard internal components, in conjunction with extended servicing, it's proving to be the disaster that we all expected

https://www.facebook.com/share/g/RgByvv3c1...tid=wwXIfr

It’s the Ignium 2.0 Diesel that seems to be the issue 2021 L405 Vogue SE 4.4 V8 DIESEL ~ #17

So are we saying this doesn’t affect the 4.4 diesel? --
On my third Full Fat RR
there's nothing like it.

Mikey wrote:

The 405 (along with all other JLR models) is fitted with the Ingenium lump. On paper, it's a fantastic engine, offset crank, variable flow water and oil pumps, all in the search of improved efficiency

In practice, its a truly woeful engine that was rushed out, with substandard internal components, in conjunction with extended servicing, it's proving to be the disaster that we all expected

It does seem to be the 2.0L variant that gets all the bad press, maybe because in volume terms it's been fitted to vastly more of the "non-high end" JLR products range like Jags, Evoques and Disco Sports. SWMBO's in the market for a newish Disco Sport and won't have anything but a diesel but I'm not overly concerned. To be honest. I think 21k/24mth service intervals on a diesel engine with all the EGR/DPF/Emissions gubbins is asking for trouble. Besides, I always have our cars covered by warranties so they can take the risk of any engine failures.

I did a great deal of online trawling before I went out searching for a diesel MY21 D350 as I knew they all had the 3.0L Ingenium and, although I found all the expected oil dilution commentary, nothing put me off having one. My 4.4SDV8 also had oil dilution issues but easily resolvable with good maintenance and regular oil/filter changes.

The Ingenium range may not be the best in the world (and given the option I'd have rathered the old SDV8) but I guess it must be OK if looked after properly (i.e. 5000mile oil changes etc) 2021 D350 Fifty Edition - Carpathian Grey
2017 4.4 SDV8 Autobiography (2021-2024) - Santorini Black
2012 4.4 TDV8 Westminster (2016-2021) - Santorini Black

D3Jon wrote:

Mikey wrote:

The 405 (along with all other JLR models) is fitted with the Ingenium lump. On paper, it's a fantastic engine, offset crank, variable flow water and oil pumps, all in the search of improved efficiency

In practice, its a truly woeful engine that was rushed out, with substandard internal components, in conjunction with extended servicing, it's proving to be the disaster that we all expected

The L405 has the 6 cyl Ingenium engine, not the 4 cyl one the article is most likely referring to (fitted to Jaguar F Pace, Disco Sport, RR Evoque's, etc)

Did a fair bit of Googling for an elderly neighbour who's looking at buying a Disco 5 with the 6 cyl Ingenium, couldn't find any bad information regarding it. Perhaps it's too new, or it is a better made engine?

The 2.0L 4 cyl engine is another matter - that suffers a horrific failure rate, and the engine boys reckon it's not just down to oil dilution, with many suggesting it's just a bad design made using sub-standard materials.

Jon

The problem is when the Ingenium is mounted transversely in the Disco Sport / Evoque. There isn't enough room to mount the DPF where it needs to be, i.e. right on the exhaust manifold.

So it doesn't work as well, and hence the oil dilution.

Not a problem on 'proper' vehicles, like Range Rover and Jaguar.

Chris. L405 - 4.4SDV8 Vogue
P38 - 4.6V8 HSE
Land Rover series IIA V8

My general understanding is that a lot of the issues derive from oil dilution and that land rovers solution to DPF design markedly increases the possibility of oil dilution occurring.

This is due to the engines and their position in the engine bays meaning that the DPF has had to be pushed further down the exhaust routes rather than being as close to the exhaust manifold as possible.

As a result the longer distance means that the exhaust gas cools too much before reaching the DPF such that passive regen is less likely, and that active regen has to be used. So more fuel has to be pushed into the exhaust in order to heat up the longer length of exhaust to the DPF = more fuel seeping past the pistons. Longer length to heat up = longer heat up times = more likely to have a failed regen on shorter journeys = more fuel seeping past pistons.

I think the 4.4 has similar issues as its such a big lump that the DPF cant fit close to the engine due to the limitations of the engine bay size. There is no doubt that my 4.4 does more regens, and suffers reduced service intervals compared to my 3.0 BMW straight six which is longitudally mounted with plenty of space around it. V8 or else ...

Looking at a few d350’s, to open a can of worms…….

What do we think on a used 20 plate d350 purchase full LrSH but it’s had 18 month intervals currently on 45,000 last serviced in Nov 23 so about 10k ago, previous to that May 22. It sounds like it’s been done every 14-16000 which is over and above LR…. Not what I would do or most of us Fattie fans I dare say, but still a FSH and in line with an SDV8 or SDV6 LR interval and deffo more than 2/20k that Lr recommend.  There is nothing that can't be fixed with a hammer😜😜
FFRR 4.4 SDV8 Autobiography Santorini Black.
KIA E-Niro 4+
2010 LR D4 Commercial 2.7 TDV6

I’m probably not going to be popular with this - but i would (and did) avoid anything with an Ignium engine in it - I went for the last of the V8 Diesels and would do exactly the same again - I’m on my 3rd V8 Diesel and everyone has been faultless - absolutely no chance repeating that reliability record with any Igniboom engine.

If I couldn’t have bought an SDV8, it would have been
A 5.0 petrol - it’s as simple as that 👍🏻😃 2021 L405 Vogue SE 4.4 V8 DIESEL ~ #17

We had a Disco Sport a while back, bought it late 2019

Took 9 months for a 2.2 Auto to come up for sale in Scotland. We could have bought a higher spec, lower mileage 2.0 Ingenium for less money. But no chance I'd have one
Sold it 2 years ago to a customer, and it's still going strong

Meanwhile, we are seeing Ingenium engines struggling to make it past 50k

SDV8 would be my preference too. Not much wrong with mine tbh, and not many on the market……🫤 There is nothing that can't be fixed with a hammer😜😜
FFRR 4.4 SDV8 Autobiography Santorini Black.
KIA E-Niro 4+
2010 LR D4 Commercial 2.7 TDV6

Vogue wrote:

I’m probably not going to be popular with this - but i would (and did) avoid anything with an Ignium engine in it - I went for the last of the V8 Diesels and would do exactly the same again - I’m on my 3rd V8 Diesel and everyone has been faultless - absolutely no chance repeating that reliability record with any Igniboom engine.

If I couldn’t have bought an SDV8, it would have been
A 5.0 petrol - it’s as simple as that 👍🏻😃

SDV8 is just as bad with oil dilution, especially if you are rural or only do 20min trips etc My next one will be a petrol 5.0 before 2030  2018 SE SDV8 4.4 Byron Blue