As the title suggest I have a MY12 VSE which I love - not kept any vehicle as long but starting to think about what comes next - love this site and have been reading around the threads - fantastic resource

So covid allowing I use my vehicle for trips to train the gun dog at the weekends and shooting trips in the season - the L322 has been awesome and still is - it obviously now owes me nothing

I know about the issues with the 4 cylinder diesel Defender and the 3 lt V6 FFRR and that the new model is arriving soon

I guess my current dilemma is do I keep the L322 for the next 18 months - do I get a MY19 FFRR V8 in VSE or AutoB after the new dash/info system came in and the other tweaks I like or do I jump to a 6 cylinder Defender

From some searching around I am seeing some FFRRs in the broadly ok spec from late 2018 in the range 58-65k depending on mileage and other factors and a well specced New Defender new or nearly new is in the same bracket if not higher priced

I would be interested in the thoughts of those of you who have been working through the same considerations

The FFRR seems such a lot of vehicle but I am trying to think though the effect the new model will have on residuals - I got my L322 as a near last of the run and have not regretted it which attracts me to the MY19 if I can c9me in under 60k and keep until the charging network makes the EV alternative more viable for my usage pattern and the EV premium reduces

Hi FlyingTrotter ....
I borrowed a new Defender late last year some time. Have had a 110 Defender before and had Disco 4 and before that a Disco 2. The new defender is very accomplished but my main issue was that I personally found the visibility terrible for a LR product. The windows are very shallow and I really wasn’t happy manoeuvring it at all. For our family it also wasn’t big enough on the boot space if the rear seats are far back enough to be useful.
Now have a 2018 VSE RR. Main dealer car, perfect spec for me and I got it for less than you’ve quoted. Couldn’t imagine realistically spending MORE on a new Defender personally unless you literally live on a farm in which case I would probably get a Land Cruiser over a new defender due again to price and muckability
The value of circa 2018 RR’s I think will hold up as you can bet on the new RR being way more expensive given how much new cars are now. And very little in the way of discounts. So these very nice £56k cars will seem like bargains compared with new ones at probably over £100k. Just my two penneth! I love my RR VSE and the facelift brought nice changes over the previous one.
Its now back at the garage having some bits looked at though LOL

Hi FT..I think you will need to spend over £60k for a decent specced Defender. Lovely car but it hasn't got the luxury of a FFRR, so really depends what you are really after. Is it a general purpose car for on and off-road or is it mainly on road with a bit of off-road in the shooting season with the dog in the back? That's what my car is for.

I recently sold my 2018 VSE with 24k miles for about the same as you want to spend. I know which I'd rather have. A word of warning though......if you go for a 2018/19 facelift make sure the car has no software issues across the Duo screens. LR had it sorted for the 2020 but just make sure there are no bugs as it's quite frustrating Otherwise the car was superb and you get a lot of car for £60k in a VSE  All LR cars from 1984
2021.5 Vogue SE D300 Carpathian Grey
2018 Vogue SE British Racing Green GONE

Thank you guys - really good comments - I hadn’t seen the info on that software fault

The L405 will be mainly on road and perhaps 10-15 days shooting when will do some off road stuff but nothing excessive - the L322 is now on General Grabbers which have been great - presume that the L405 can take something like that as long as on 21 inch wheels not the 22 inch

You can fit 20” wheels to the L405 for more tire selection.

My new car is fitted with Pirelli Scorpion Verde tyres, the same as fitted to their cars on the Solihull off-road and Jungle track which were pretty good when I drove them on Tuesday. Grabber AT3's are the best I would have thought as I had AT2's on one of my cars and they were very quiet on road and brilliant off-road  All LR cars from 1984
2021.5 Vogue SE D300 Carpathian Grey
2018 Vogue SE British Racing Green GONE

Thanks guys

I moved from a 2013 L405 AB SDV8 to a P300 Defender and I have no regrets. I absolutely love the Defender. 2019 L405 SDV8 Autobiography
2023 Defender P400e HSE X-dynamic - gone
2020 Defender P300 SE - gone

2019 Jaguar F-Pace SVR - gone
2013 SDV8 Autobiography - gone
2011 L322 TDV8 Vogue SE - gone
2006 L322 3.6 Vogue Se - gone
1999 P38 4.0 se - gone
199? Classic 3.5 - gone

I priced up a Defender for wifey the other day and with a good spec (for us) it came in at £53k which surprised me pleasantly...

What did you go for engine wise - reading on here and elsewhere I see concerns over the SD4 that they initially had in the new Defender and then stopped using. - is the V6 they are now using the same one that had issues in the L405 ?

Maybe not - I find it all so confusing at the moment with the pricing, reported issues and banning/pricing out of ICE and the crap range and poor charging networks

My full list of vehicles is actually

- L405 SDV8 in VSE or Auto
- new Defender but as above I am really confused over what would make sense and the huge number of different packages doesn’t assist - maybe the Diesel 250 in SE
- The Ineos Grenadier (or Legionnaire as it’s now french) with BMW engine but will it be reliable - what about servicing and will the interior be too basic
- The Rivian but will late 2022 early 2023 be too early for a full EV 4x4 - my L322 TDV8 manages 530 miles to a tank - Rivian are saying launch vehicles will have 300 mile range depending on conditions and usage - it’s not bad but if I drive from London to Devon/Somerset shooting I’ll need to recharge enroute to have enough juice for the shoot day and again on the return - maybe it’s doable but same issues with servicing and is it too big a lump for the UK and will it actually arrive in that time frame or be late 2023 before right hand drive are here in the UK and will I be the only bloke in the country with one and so not cost effective to establish the support infra structure

Maybe I should Keep the L322 until a better option comes along - go L405 or Defender for 3 years and then see about maybe the Rivian option - decisions decisions

If it were me, I'd happily go for the L405 with no questions asked. Done deal.

By now, it's a very well 'sorted' machine - a known quantity and the natural progression to the L322.

The Defender is, I am sure, a great vehicle - but I'd give it a few years before buying one. At least until it reaches its mid-life cycle refresh.

Electirc-wise, I think we are only a few years away from the batteries being awesome and having the proper charging network to facilitate hassle-free ownership. 2012 4.4 TDV8 Westminster - Baltic Blue, Jet interior
1997 P38 2.5 DSE auto & 1998 P38 2.5 DT Manual
1988 Vogue 3.5 EFI - Manual, gone.
2004 Volvo C70 2.0T convertible, had since new.
2007 Mazda MX-5 2.0 Sport Roadster/Coupé, had since new.
2024 Mini Cooper S cabrio, JCW kit, 2.0, DCT auto