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Captain Black



Member Since: 13 Mar 2018
Location: Cambridgeshire
Posts: 30

England 2018 Range Rover Vogue TDV6 Corris Grey
Diesel, Euro V - v- Euro VI

Having just read a thread regarding a member's choice of second hand vehicle I thought the below might be useful:

I do some work with the Passenger Transport industry and am aware that many operators thought they were saving money by purchasing Euro V vehicles (which was possible in the UK due to a loop hole in the legislation) long after the European Union directive (2015). What has now happened is the residual values of these euro V vehicles have now collapsed leaving a big hole between the write down value and the actual value. I imagine the same has affected the LGV sector.

Retrofitting of expensive exhaust gas after treatment systems to commercial vehicles is now big business.

Whilst the above might not directly correlate to passenger cars at the moment the principle could well be the same before long due to the number of proposed Clean Air Zones (CAZ). Up till now only London has been charging for the Low Emission Zone (LEZ) and more recently the introduction of the Ultra-Low Emission Zone (ULEZ). Off the top of my head there are currently at least 5 other towns and cities. Leeds, Southampton, Nottingham and Derby (undergoing consultation). Birmingham has just published their plans. All the above are or will more than likely charge for (all) vehicles not meeting Euro IV (petrol) and Euro VI (diesel) by 2020.

I would also imagine before too long, vehicles not meeting the above standards may be subject to a number of additional government lead levies and charges. One option might be to increase road fund licence charges.


Just my two pence worth.....

If you have trouble getting off to sleep you might want to read the following:
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/public-...nce-review 2019 BMW 440i convertable (hers)
2018 (MY2017) RR Vogue (mine)
2016 Mercedes SLK (her's, gone)
2016 Honda CB1100EX (calm sunny days)
2015 Honda CRF250 full blown motocross (when my bad back is up to it)
2013 Ducati 1199 Panigale (Gone. It would have killed me)
2012 Kubota B Series Tractor (The grass doesn't cut itself)
2011 Honda CB1000 Fireblade (Crazy sunny days)
Last 20 years mix of Mercedes E & ML Class

Post #510102 28th Mar 2019 12:54pm
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GGDR



Member Since: 26 Nov 2016
Location: London
Posts: 3545

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV8 Stornoway Grey

I'm inside the central London ULEZ zone so as a resident I have 2.5 years to get rid of my Euro V RR.
Which I'm not happy about. It might be time for a vehicle change by then but I'd rather make that choice rather than having it shoved down my throat.

I researched before purchase and chose Euro V which was ok but Khan moved the goalposts. Problem is, TFL (Transport for London) and the Mayor's office for that matter are more of a dictatorship than a democracy. Don't get me started. Wait too late.

I do wonder if some clever people could bring out an affordable AdBlue conversion to make A V a VI. And yes you're right:

Quote:
Retrofitting of expensive exhaust gas after treatment systems to commercial vehicles is now big business.


But these aren't for cars and / or too expensive for cars. If someone can do it I'll buy one.

. Cheers, Greg
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2011 Vogue SE 4.4 with lots of toys in Stornaway

Post #510125 28th Mar 2019 3:44pm
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Baltic Blue



Member Since: 13 Aug 2015
Location: North Wales
Posts: 3774

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV8 Baltic Blue

Greg,
I feel it is only a matter of time before Manchester brings in a similar scheme.
A couple of questions if you don’t mind.
1) Would a 5.0l petrol 2011 be exempt? or maybe charged at a lower rate than a 4.4 tdV8 ?
2) If a retrofit adblue kit became available, how would you prove it was now a Cat6 car?

My long term plan has always been to keep B.B. but I fear, like you being “priced out”
Mike. G reg 2.5VM Vogue Portofino red 1991- 1999
V reg 2.5td P38 Rioja red 1999- 2006
53 reg td6 Vogue Oslo blue 2006- 2015
11 reg 4.4 TdV8 Vogue SE. Baltic blue 2015- date.
https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic56162...tty+affair

Post #510128 28th Mar 2019 4:57pm
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Robert



Member Since: 25 Oct 2011
Location: Perigueux
Posts: 2289

France 2007 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Zambezi Silver

In Germany the conversion from 5 to 6 has started for all cars and Daimler and VW (yes;-) have said that they probably will help with the conversion costs for their costumers. Costs seem to range from 2000 to 5000 euro. It seems that the fuel consumption will go up with 5% when the system is build in.

For those that read German
https://www.autozeitung.de/euro-6-nachruesten-183792.html#

Post #510132 28th Mar 2019 5:25pm
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GGDR



Member Since: 26 Nov 2016
Location: London
Posts: 3545

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV8 Stornoway Grey

Quote:
Would a 5.0l petrol 2011 be exempt?

Yes Mike 5.0 petrol (Euro 5) is ok in Khan's ULEZ, it's evil diesels that must be min. Euro 6

It's all completely unreasonable when there are all sorts of things unchecked - refrigeration units on trucks are spewing out un-filtered emissions, generators running 24/7 and plant equipment too. Those event lights that were placed all over Hyde Park for Winter Wonderland that are trailered light and generator units running all through dark hours when thy could just run cables and no emissions.

Don't get me started. Wait too late. Again.


. Cheers, Greg
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2011 Vogue SE 4.4 with lots of toys in Stornaway

Post #510165 28th Mar 2019 11:27pm
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GGDR



Member Since: 26 Nov 2016
Location: London
Posts: 3545

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV8 Stornoway Grey

Quote:
2) If a retrofit adblue kit became available, how would you prove it was now a Cat6 car?


If you got one fitted (if there were one on the UK) it would have to come with certification / reclassification to Euro 6

. Cheers, Greg
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2011 Vogue SE 4.4 with lots of toys in Stornaway

Post #510166 28th Mar 2019 11:29pm
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paulbrown22



Member Since: 23 Dec 2017
Location: London/Poole
Posts: 352

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Supercharged 5.0 SC V8 Stornoway Grey

Baltic Blue wrote:
Greg,
1) Would a 5.0l petrol 2011 be exempt? or maybe charged at a lower rate than a 4.4 tdV8 ?


Under London's current ULEZ regulations about to come into force, yes, the 5.0 S/C is exempt (as is the 4.2 S/C), which is exactly why I swapped my diesel Defender for one. But, as Greg alluded to earlier, who's to say the goalposts won't move again at a random time of their choosing...! So, for now, I'm safe, but after next week my wife won't be able to drive her super economical 2011 1.4 diesel Fiesta through the centre of town without paying, and we'll be forced to take the 5.0 S/C and burn much more petrol. Ludicrous.

The current regs are Euro 4 for petrol (generally ~2005 onwards), but Euro 6 for diesel (generally Sept 2015 onwards) because of the change to measure particulate emissions/NOx instead of CO2 which was the thing for the previous 20 years. I'm sure they'll change their minds again at some point on what exactly to measure and how.

Post #510169 28th Mar 2019 11:38pm
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GGDR



Member Since: 26 Nov 2016
Location: London
Posts: 3545

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV8 Stornoway Grey

Oh is it Euro 4 for petrol Paul? Didn't realise....

Greg

. Cheers, Greg
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2011 Vogue SE 4.4 with lots of toys in Stornaway

Post #510172 28th Mar 2019 11:54pm
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Philip



Member Since: 05 Jan 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 2567

2019 Range Rover Autobiography SDV8 Aintree Green

Yes, Euro 4 for petrol.

ULEZ is a nonsense - I don’t think people have realised the impact it will have when it expands.

Post #510200 29th Mar 2019 9:17am
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Robert



Member Since: 25 Oct 2011
Location: Perigueux
Posts: 2289

France 2007 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Zambezi Silver

How is LPG regarded in this systems? Anyone?

Post #510204 29th Mar 2019 9:49am
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SilverParrot



Member Since: 09 Aug 2018
Location: Herts
Posts: 25

United Kingdom 2004 Range Rover Vogue Td6 Zambezi Silver

LPG only works on petrol engines so the regs are the same as for petrol.
If an earlier (pre euro IV) petrol engine was converted it would still be able to be run on petrol so would be liable for the charge.

Post #510205 29th Mar 2019 10:15am
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Robert



Member Since: 25 Oct 2011
Location: Perigueux
Posts: 2289

France 2007 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Zambezi Silver

Yes I know that LPG works only on petrol engines, however here in France LPG is regarded as ethanol etc. in the whole system and one is free to circulate in the zones that are regarded as "poluted" and that are sometimes completely closed for diesel euro 5 and lower and petrol 4 and lower during polution periods (hot days, no wind etc.) Everyone has to buy a sticker however for the windshield with a 1 to 6 classification to enter the big cities and typical French 1 is clean and 6 is most poluting. So my 4.4 ltr petrol car with LPG has a green sticker with a proud 1 Wink (don't forget that this system is also an obligation for tourtists)

Post #510210 29th Mar 2019 11:15am
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Bill



Member Since: 18 Nov 2017
Location: Essex / Normandy
Posts: 1233

United Kingdom 

gonna_go_double_r wrote:
Quote:
Would a 5.0l petrol 2011 be exempt?

Yes Mike 5.0 petrol (Euro 5) is ok in Khan's ULEZ, it's evil diesels that must be min. Euro 6

It's all completely unreasonable when there are all sorts of things unchecked - refrigeration units on trucks are spewing out un-filtered emissions, generators running 24/7 and plant equipment too.

Don't get me started. Wait too late. Again.

.

Belated comment , been busy!

Don’t forget log burners .... that’s more than transport ...

Posted before- no link, Landrover not a FFRR , was the only car in a test that came out with better than advertised real time pollution level, About time JLR started to boast about their cars & engineering instead of being the whipping boy . Filters are in fact so good that in certain circumstances, when the ambient air is already polluted, a diesel car will tend to extract more particles from the air than it emits. Emissions Analytics worked with........etc etc

He who dies with the most toys wins...

Post #510865 4th Apr 2019 11:05am
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scotcruz



Member Since: 03 May 2017
Location: S C O T L A N D
Posts: 391

Scotland 2010 Range Rover HSE TDV8 Zambezi Silver

Checked my reg on the ULEZ website and the charge applies.. essentially, it will be congestion + ULEZ charge of £24. Looks like I wont be driving into London next time Im there Smile

Click image to enlarge
 Current:
- L560 Velar HSE R-Dynamic D180
- Peugeot 508 2011 - 2.2 HDi GT

Past:
- FFRR V 2010 - 3.6 TDV8
- Citroen C4 1.6i Petrol
- Mitsubishi Shogun 3.2 DID
- Peugeot 607 2.2 HDi
- Nissan Primera 1.8 SVE
- Honda Civic 1.6 VTEC

Post #511270 7th Apr 2019 9:30pm
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martinf



Member Since: 26 Dec 2014
Location: sussex
Posts: 256

United Kingdom 2016 Range Rover Vogue TDV6 Santorini Black

Just checked my farm tractor which is a 17 year old diesel but it is not subject to the extra charge!!!!
Not that I want to drive it to London

Post #511294 8th Apr 2019 7:00am
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