L322 TDV8
When the LR Technical Manual is used in conjunction with the IIDTool it can be misleading as to what is a normal / appropriate DPF Soot Fill level. I have spent 4 months, 3000 miles and a lot of money figuring this out. A number of people have been worrying completely un-necessarily like I did, I hope this stops that.

Bear in mind L322s rarely work completely identically!

1) According to 2 Land Rover Chief Technicians and one of the original L322 design engineers the DPF will happily run indefinitely with a Soot Fill of 20,21,22,23g. What I mean by this is it keeps demanding regens and regenning a little like 23g down to 20g etc. . This is perfectly normal and nothing to worry about. You will only go up to a Yellow Warning Light if you are in the middle of a city, heavy traffic or repeatedly doing short trips (in which case this is the wrong car for you).
2) Regens do not occur on a straight line graph and the Regen frequency increases as the Soot Fill goes higher. It will regen repeatedly over about 20g as long as you are moving.
3) The most common reason for a DPF Yellow Warning Light is taking multiple trips of less than approximately 4 miles.
4) Do not think that every regen must take you to 3-7g. You will only get down to that level when you are on open road.
5) The speed requirement for a Regen over 20g changes, it is not necessary to be going faster than 37mph. It will Regen at slow speeds, as long as you aren't sitting in very slow traffic or a traffic jam!
6) There are somewhere between 100,000 and 200,000 L322 TDV8s out there, with only a tiny handful of DPF problems -most concerns are people seeing what they (completely understandably) wrongly interpret as "high" Soot Fill on their IIDTool after getting 1 or 2 DPF Full Yellow Warning Light instances.
7) New Land Rovers engines are designed and expected to produce Soot at a rate of 1g per 10 miles for a 2 litre engine.
8. Crucially: Bear in mind Land Rover and Ford would not design an engine and management system that would require user intervention or additional tools in order to operate properly in any of their cars, let alone their flagship model.

I have tested the above over 3000 miles of mixed driving conditions including no open road for weeks at a time. I spreadsheeted, documented and graphed all the data. I have also done all of the above in consultation with two LR Chief Technicians and one of the original design team from the L322, they 100% concur and guarantee this is working precisely as designed. I have this in writing from Land Rover.

Now there are other factors that can give you a DPF Full Yellow Warning Light. Like a blocked MAF sensor. However it is a good rule of thumb that if you don't have a Yellow Warning Light you probably don't have a problem.

and here's the ultimate advice: if you do get a DPF Full Yellow Warning Light, go for a drive... one of two things will happen - you will get a Red Warning Light and Limp mode or the Warning Light will go out. Also this is not the right car if you are in a heavily congested city, these care are completely un-suitable for Tokyo, Mumbai or Central London!.

If you would like additional info please feel free to ask or PM me.
I hope this saves someone the time and money I spent on it.



.

Last edited by Range Rover L322 on 11th Jan 2020 2:37pm. Edited 24 times in total

Totally agree. Don't go looking for an issue with an IID if the car isn't giving you any warnings i.e. amber warning light. And, don't buy a 4.4 tdv8 (with a DPF) if you're just doing low daily mileage and not giving the car a chance to burn off its dirty soot Gone to a good home: 2011 4.4 TDV8 Vogue SE Buckingham Blue with Ivory and clear glass = "Rory"
2025MY Defender D350 90 in Silicon Silver on coils
1974 Series 3 Lightweight = "Millie"
Many, many other Landies over the years
My preferred specialist: www.glenrands.co.uk
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Unnecessary quote removed

Wow! That's what you call informative................many thanks! 2012 Orkney Grey Westminster 4.4TDV8 with Ivory interior.........nice!
Alfa Romeo Giulietta
Just one Montesa now, 349 White Wonder
Austin A40 Farina MK2
1975 Morris Marina 1.8TC
1973 Honda CB250 K4

Quote:

1) A DPF will happily run indefinitely with a Soot Fill of 20,21,22,23g. This is perfectly normal and nothing to worry about.

Matt?

Not true but some oddball cars have definitely experienced this.
Eg Regen'ing while sitting in traffic.

If you continue city driving at 23g the yellow light will come on sharpish at 23.3g (see my chart page 1).

All you need to do at that point is hit a bit of road, set the cruise at 50mph and it should sort itself. If you're not getting either warning then carry on camping. Whatever you're doing works.

There's no explanation for cars that kinda do their own forced regen but if it keeps high soot output cars happy and soot managed then all good. In this case put away the IID and drive into the sunset.

The soot value is a calculated number, not an actual reading and it's based on pressure differential voltage value and a bunch of other parameters.

With more experience with mine, I've also learnt that the DPF is more robust than the soot value indicates. Eg a forced regen effectively resets the calculated soot grams to zero and you can keep going. Which I recently did with my new DA-DPF Tool. After reset, soot kept climbing and although it read say 5g that would have been 33g without the reset.

But it kept going to 20g so from the red at 28 that would be 48g without a regen.

But as I said it's a theoretical number and the ECU is tricked by the reset and the real health of the DPF - the exhaust pressure - was ok, as measured by the pressure differential voltage value.

Mine would not regen until I hit 20 (kinda 48g if you add the two) it regen'ed fine and has been fine with a second regen since then back to 1g

Ash does build up and is not incinerated as opposed to soot which burns off so I suspect people with ongoing issues and high miles may need off-car cleaning like I had a while back.

.



. Cheers, Greg
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2011 Vogue SE 4.4 with lots of toys in Stornaway

Quote:

1.5 when accelerating - I'm going to check this tomorrow

Hi all

At what soot level should a regen happen? Mine is showing 20.2? Strangley remaining volume in DPF is showing zero? Not sure if that's a red herrin?

@m@r]{

You won't get a reading of remaining volume. I don't think the IID can measure this.

20.2 is fine. Regen will happen at all levels but when the conditions align (regular speed over 37 mph etc)

And with some fuel in the tank. Needs over a 1/4 iirc Gone to a good home: 2011 4.4 TDV8 Vogue SE Buckingham Blue with Ivory and clear glass = "Rory"
2025MY Defender D350 90 in Silicon Silver on coils
1974 Series 3 Lightweight = "Millie"
Many, many other Landies over the years
My preferred specialist: www.glenrands.co.uk
--------------------------------------------------

M@r]{ wrote:

Hi all

At what soot level should a regen happen? Mine is showing 20.2? Strangley remaining volume in DPF is showing zero? Not sure if that's a red herrin?

Following my successful resolution of the dpf full/ red warning appearing a while ago, car has been behaved faultlessly with daily 50 mile motorway trips. Dpf was sitting around 20g (following Posts on here not a worry).

However returning from London the other night on the M4 I got restricted performance and red dpf (dealer!!) warning. IID said level of 27.7g. Luckily it was only 10 miles from home and although I stopped and used my IID to reset, fault remained and I limped home.

No faults!! IID revealed nothing. I removed and cleaned the MAP which was Jammed full of crud. Warning remained and restricted performance

https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/post538709.html#538709

Right, a high pressure smoke test has identified a small crack in the Pax side Inlet manifold. This appears to have caused the DPF to fill up and be unable to regen.

However the DPF sensor (rear) has a voltage of 0.83 and the dealer is saying it needs to be 1.1V minimum and should be replaced. I am unsure. Can anyone confirm what the voltage should really be? (I have seen Baltic Blue and GGDR's screen shots of their IIDs and they show 0.7-0.8V. I understood the correct voltage to be c. 0.7V.)

Can anyone who has replaced their inlet Manifold let me know the cost please?

Also, the dealer is saying they can't force regen as the reading is 29g and the LR software won't let them regen. yet I know of someone who had a forced regen at 28g. can anyone confirm the cut off level?

thanks
DB

Last edited by Dolphinboy on 11th Jan 2020 5:51pm. Edited 2 times in total

Good news you may now have found the root cause of your ongoing soot issues DB.

Firstly, differential voltage:

0.7 is normal
1.0 is high but ok as long as it comes back to 0.7 after a regen
up to 1.5 when accelerating

I am not sure about your values at 8-something volts but they say should be 1-something.
It might be that is the single sensor's value. But what they say sounds odd.
Differential voltage is the before and after sensor difference which is what it uses to determine flow.

Regeneration: So when my red DPF went off last year (due to air intake leak which is 90% of cases) I used my DA-Dongle DPFDR which effectively zeroed my DPF. This allowed a regeneration but not until I hit 20g. Before zero it was 28 and 28+20 = 48g which you'd think would fubar the DPF. But not at all. It's been fine since. In fact I used my DA-Dongle today at 15g to force a regen as I wanted to make use of a motorway trip. 0.5g at the end. The DA-Dongle gives a longer burn and it's less fussy on driving conditions. Eg I can come off the m-way, turn around even sit on a red light before returning to the m-way and it will keep burning or resume burning.

The other tool that can reset the DPF is the IID ( i think it says fit new DPF ) but I have not tried this. So anyone reading this, go ahead at your own risk. I'm just saying what the IID can do. It seems to be the same as the DA-Dongle in this respect.

All this taught me the DPF is a more robust thing that the over-protective ECU leads us to believe.

This is from my earlier post:

Quote:

The soot value is a calculated number, not an actual reading and it's based on pressure differential voltage value and a bunch of other parameters.

With more experience with mine, I've also learnt that the DPF is more robust than the soot value indicates. Eg a forced regen effectively resets the calculated soot grams to zero and you can keep going. Which I recently did with my new DA-DPF Tool. After reset, soot kept climbing and although it read say 5g that would have been 33g without the reset.

But it kept going to 20g so from the red at 28 that would be 48g without a regen.

But as I said it's a theoretical number and the ECU is tricked by the reset and the real health of the DPF - the exhaust pressure - was ok, as measured by the pressure differential voltage value.

Mine would not regen until I hit 20 (kinda 48g if you add the two) it regen'ed fine and has been fine with a second regen since then back to 1g

Ash does build up and is not incinerated as opposed to soot which burns off so I suspect people with ongoing issues and high miles may need off-car cleaning like I had a while back.

Hi Greg

Thanks for your input. Have amended the voltage figures (left out the zero). New sensor fitted but the cut off for a forced regen is 28.5g and as mine is now reading 29 the LR software can’t regen. I have been quoted£400 (all in) for a Dpf clean (without removal) and £1600 for the manifold replacement

Are you using a main dealer or a decent indy? Gone to a good home: 2011 4.4 TDV8 Vogue SE Buckingham Blue with Ivory and clear glass = "Rory"
2025MY Defender D350 90 in Silicon Silver on coils
1974 Series 3 Lightweight = "Millie"
Many, many other Landies over the years
My preferred specialist: www.glenrands.co.uk
--------------------------------------------------

Ah geez £1600 - wow.
Do you spanner yourself?

I had my DPF removed and it was £250 flash cleaned here in London.
See page 1 of this mega topic.
You don't have to get your DPF cleaned you could get the DA-DPF dongle.
I think they are £170-ish
And you get to keep it / use it again / sell it.

I'd walk away from your dealer/mechanic who is saying the sensor should be 1.1 or more.

The higher the number, the more blocked it is.
What's the number right now?

. Cheers, Greg
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2011 Vogue SE 4.4 with lots of toys in Stornaway