Sounds like the master cylinder to me. Had the same issue on a Ford Fiesta years ago. Thought I'd be a clever sod and bleed all 4 corners at once as we were changing the fluid. Opened all bleed screws, pipes in jars, all ready. Assistant mashed foot into the carpet and the pedal wouldn't come back up. Both front and rear seals in the MC were torn.

Probably done a similar thing with the pedal going down so far. They are delicate and tear easily when pushed beyond design limits. Ever since my experience I always use an Easi-Bleed and let the air pressure force clean fluid through. I never move the pedal whilst bleed screws are open now.

jfarrell32 wrote:

Great help thanks

jfarrell32 wrote:

I'll stick that in the "I told you so" bucket.

mzplcg wrote:

Sounds like the master cylinder to me. Had the same issue on a Ford Fiesta years ago. Thought I'd be a clever sod and bleed all 4 corners at once as we were changing the fluid. Opened all bleed screws, pipes in jars, all ready. Assistant mashed foot into the carpet and the pedal wouldn't come back up. Both front and rear seals in the MC were torn.

Probably done a similar thing with the pedal going down so far. They are delicate and tear easily when pushed beyond design limits. Ever since my experience I always use an Easi-Bleed and let the air pressure force clean fluid through. I never move the pedal whilst bleed screws are open now.

Cam-Tech-Craig wrote:

Just trying to get an important safety notice across to any other members reading this.

Thanks Craig, I now know not to drive with no brakes. I will now fix my brakes before driving past the infant school.

Mmmmmm the only time I was in a car with no brakes (a Citroen) we didn't get very far. Main reason the rear subframe with wheels and all came off ripping the hydraulic system apart. Thanks to the body of the car (and a lot of weight in it) dragging on the road surface we stopped pretty damn quick.

Now driving "without brakes" in an automatic seems virtually impossible to me as you would have a problem slowing or stopping. So lets conclude that driving without brakes is virtually impossible and that driving with "limited" brake capacity, especially knowing that it could fail completely at any point in time is irresponsible.

Having said that, I rode a bike (many many many years ago) that had too much air in the brakes and I had to "pump" up the pressure before stopping, now that is plain stupid/irresponsible.

So my point is, if the braking is insufficient to drive safely then don't. If the brakes are not "perfect" but you are sure you can stop quickly enough in an emergency situation, a carefull drive to a garage could be acceptable under certain circumstances IMHO.

I just did the front brakes on the Kawasaki ZX14 that I reassembled after 5 years in storage and had no problem with the brakes but I was very gentle in letting the system fill up by itself first before even touching the brake lever. I do regret not going for the braided brake lines (I have the originals on there still) because that would have made the braking less spongy. But it is in VERY good conditions still (well the bike only did some 6000 miles in one year and then went into storage for 7 years ). MY 2010 5.0 SC Galway green and sand interior!!
Have the Faultmate MSV2 Extreme to be tinkering with the settings etc. !!

Cam-Tech-Craig wrote:

jfarrell32 wrote:

seals may have been damaged when the system was empty and I was driving it (only for a few kms to garage after discovering problem). Does this sound likely?

You drove it with a "split brake hose" really

Do you guys not have recovery vehicles over there? I wouldn't even start the engine on a FF with a split brake hose... Let alone try driving it sir

Dear All, any input welcome.

Latest is that after many efforts to bleed the system the brakes are working. However there is travel in the pedal when you press for the first attempt to break. Mechanic has been testing and ABS etc all working but the travel is still a problem and is not correct. He has followed the process and has the technology to do this. He plans to drive it for this week and then try bleeding again after some use to try and correct the travel in the pedal. If this does not resolve it the last resort is to take out the master cylinder and check seals and possibly replace. He is still not convinced that it is a Master Cylinder problem. Any thoughts welcome - seems like a simple leak has turned into a painful problem.....

IMO that would point to the master cylinder again..... Pete
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