Diesel in the crank starts flashing off at 50 ish degrees, should be all gone pretty rapidly unless continous addition is occurring

Should have said sump, I suppose really, can't edit on phone though 🙄

GraemeS wrote:

D3Jon wrote:

4 - You're now running a 0W/30 oil that is 'thinner' when cold (and it's winter time)

Viscosity shouldn't be much different to 5W30 except when the ambient temperature is below the lower limit for 5W30.

dingg1 wrote:

Diesel in the crank starts flashing off at 50 ish degrees, should be all gone pretty rapidly unless continous addition is occurring

Because the dpf is regenerating regularly and adding fuel to the sump and the evaporation process can't keep up possibly?

but diesel starts evaporation at 50 odd degrees, you can't change the chemistry of that

To D3Jon: if the L322 algorithm concluded it was above critical level already it would have said so.
(There is a way to see the miles till 'service required' with the IID, right?)
Most (if not all) of the points mentioned in the file you posted are about 'driving style and usage' and how to make sure the customer knows and understands a certain 'driving style and usage' can result in necessary early oil changes.
You have read my initial post and also the UOA report.
The wear metal levels were LOW, even with the high (no doubt) dilution.
Doesn't make sense, does it?
Your 'simple math' is assuming the contamination is proportional to driven distance.
IMO that's not true, see your attached file too where less miles can create high dilution.
When a car is driven 3 miles to school and back every morning / afternoon, and doesn't even get close to operating temp, for example.

Engine oils DO have volatile components, see NOACK.
Sure, you can believe diesel will not evaporate at all and base this on the document you posted.
4-5 hours of driving every day, with everything at operating temp... how could some diesel in the oil not evaporate?

The only true way to see the condition of the oil is to take a sample now and send it in.
Maybe I will.

The old C1 oil shared down to 8,1 cSt, that's kinda thin for a 30 weight, actually, that's in the 20 weight range!
Probably because the C1 base oil is old fashioned dino oil, not synthetic.
And still the wear metals concentration were LOW!

It's not so easy to compare 5W and 0W oils at low temps as the common formula's don't work accurately in the low temp regions.
Also, the temperatures at which the flow is measured, to determine if an oil is 5W and 0W, are different.

The car started normal while in the Arctic.
It must be said the temperatures weren't super low overnight.
Lowest I've seen was -18C and that was in the South of Finland. 2012 4.4TDV8
2000 Honda S2000

SpitfireS wrote:

Quote:

Once the fuel is in the oil and diluting it ... it stays there, no matter how much driving you do after the regen.

Diesel fuel will evaporate, less fast than petrol, but still.
There are volatile parts in (even fresh!) engine oil too.
How much is measured and it's call the NOACK value.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noack_volatility_test
Even when oil sump temps will never reach 250C, some engine parts will certainly get very hot, hotter than the sump oil and they are cooled by oil.
If you think the crank case is a closed environment: remember the crank case ventilation.

So volatile components will and do have a chance to get out of the oil, especially during longer drives.

“In this test, a sample is heated at 250 °C for 60 minutes with a constant flow of air over it.”

(Quote from your very own link above) You are joking, right? “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” -where’s the fun in that?

Quote:

Gremlin500 wrote:

“In this test, a sample is heated at 250 °C for 60 minutes with a constant flow of air over it.”
(Quote from your very own link above) You are joking, right?

Of course I'm joking
The NOACK test is done to put oils under completely insane conditions, not at all related to actual engine conditions, just to make oils look bad.
The Ford Lion 4.4 TDV8 has oil jets too, you know.
Oil is sprayed under the hot pistons, it's an oil mist inside the engine.

Click image to enlarge

You know, you (in general) change your oil every 5000km or so, to make you feel good.
Fine, go ahead, it's not my money.
But don't try to justify it with your semi science or whatever someone told you on a forum without any data to backup their ideas or claims.
Just admit: "I do this because I want to and it makes me feel good to work & take care of my car."
 2012 4.4TDV8
2000 Honda S2000

dingg1 wrote:

Because the dpf is regenerating regularly and adding fuel to the sump and the evaporation process can't keep up possibly?

but diesel starts evaporation at 50 odd degrees, you can't change the chemistry of that

D3

From google ai



Minor spills: A diesel spill of 500–5,000 gallons typically evaporates within a day.

Care to explain that one then, how does that work if it needs the temperatures you say? 🤔😏😂

SpitfireS wrote:

To D3Jon: if the L322 algorithm concluded it was above critical level already it would have said so.

SpitfireS wrote:

To D3Jon:You have read my initial post and also the UOA report.
The wear metal levels were LOW, even with the high (no doubt) dilution.
Doesn't make sense, does it?

SpitfireS wrote:

To D3Jon: Your 'simple math' is assuming the contamination is proportional to driven distance.

SpitfireS wrote:

To D3Jon: Engine oils DO have volatile components, see NOACK.
Sure, you can believe diesel will not evaporate at all and base this on the document you posted.
4-5 hours of driving every day, with everything at operating temp... how could some diesel in the oil not evaporate?

SpitfireS wrote:

To D3Jon:The only true way to see the condition of the oil is to take a sample now and send it in.
Maybe I will.

It would be great if you could do an analysis now. That would see if my simple maths is correct and your current fuel dilution is in fact 4.5%

Before anyone suggests I do my own oil analysis's - I don't need to worry about them, I just change my oil every 6k miles or 6 months! I find it to be cheaper and less hassle!

Jon 1992 RR Classic 3.9 efi Vogue
2014 Disco 4 HSE
===================
Both my fatties now gone...
Previous: 2011 L322 4.4 TDV8 Vogue SE /// 2002 L322 4.4 V8 HSE /// 2009 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 XS /// 2004 Defender 90 TD5 /// 1993 110 V8 Snatch Landrover /// 2005 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 SE (Aus) /// 1990 110 Isuzu 3.9 County (Aus) /// 1976 Series III Trayback (Aus)

dingg1 wrote:

D3

From google ai



Minor spills: A diesel spill of 500–5,000 gallons typically evaporates within a day.

Care to explain that one then, how does that work if it needs the temperatures you say? 🤔😏😂

That figure comes from a paper discussing marine diesel fuel spillages where the diesel is on the water's surface a few microns thick. This with the action of the wind, sea and sun on it.

I'm not saying diesel does not evaporate from the crankcase at all, just that some remains as per the OP's own oil analysis.

I posted the document as an example that oil dilution is something that engine manufacturers themselves agree leads to premature wear of engine components.

I'm not going to respond any further to your posts on this matter. In fact I can't believe I responded to your Google AI fact above... But it did give me a good laugh  1992 RR Classic 3.9 efi Vogue
2014 Disco 4 HSE
===================
Both my fatties now gone...
Previous: 2011 L322 4.4 TDV8 Vogue SE /// 2002 L322 4.4 V8 HSE /// 2009 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 XS /// 2004 Defender 90 TD5 /// 1993 110 V8 Snatch Landrover /// 2005 Discovery 3 2.7 TDV6 SE (Aus) /// 1990 110 Isuzu 3.9 County (Aus) /// 1976 Series III Trayback (Aus)

As did your Wikipedia post for me

Have a good weekend 👍😎

We need to take into account that it doesn't naturally vent to atmosphere its a closed system there will be minimal if any natural evaporation.

The EGR cooler does its job, within the emissions control methodology. EGR cooler separates any vapour (diesel/Oil) from the exhaust gasses, liquids back to sump while the oil/diesel free gasses are recirculated via the clean air induction system.

I know this is working well in my engine, as each oil change I do (every 3k-4kmiles) which is determined by the algorithm and counts down in the Incontrol app. I put in 9.3L and get 10L minimum out.
I experience higher fuel dilution due to short journeys etc.  2018 SE SDV8 4.4 Byron Blue