I don’t understand ‘perceived value’ in relation to sale of goods. Negotiating a finance package is another matter. 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

Thanks for all the help folks, I'm a bit wiser now as to what to expect.

I've been given an offer for the job and I can't see anything causing it to not go ahead, and a Brucey bonus is the that it seems the car policy isn't rigid, as long as the car is of a modern safety standard, reliable (gulp) and looks the part then the 6 year old rule is not strictly observed so that means I can go from a late 2017 car but more likely a facelift to maybe a low end 2020 car.

Really giddy now about the job and car.

Roll on 2023. First time FFRR owner

Perceived value is a figure based on market forces. Since a used car isn’t new, it has no fixed value as set by the manufacturer of said item. Got - 2017 SDV8 Autobiography in Loire Blue
Had- 2008 TDV8 Vogue SE in Java black
Had - 2007 S/C in Stornoway Grey

The value isn’t ‘perceived’ if it’s decided by the seller. It may be influenced by many things but it shouldn’t be a starting point for negotiation in this day and age. 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

JayGee wrote:

… it shouldn’t be a starting point for negotiation in this day and age.

It wastes time. If the price is right buy it. If not don’t look at it. 2012 TDV8 Vogue (L322)

The dealer group I work for have prices on the screen and prominent text below it saying something similar to 'The price is set by <company> based upon market value for similar age, specification and mileage vehicles to give value for money, sales executives are not able to discount the price of the vehicle'

Of course, the cost of extras are where any bargaining comes in - finance, warranty, service plans etc. etc. but I think it's sensible that the cost of the vehicle is non-negotiable. Part of the reason for this is that more & more people expect a used vehicle to be to the standard expected of a new vehicle - that has a cost to the dealer, and therefore the customer, for the warranty period.
Used cars were seen as a cheaper option if you were prepared to accept some 'wear & tear', now everyone is aware of their 'rights' and is used to free meaning no cost, rather than meaning 'included in the cost' they mostly claim for frivolous stuff in the warranty period (scuffs on door cards, heated mirror glass not heating, even a sidelight bulb out or wiper blades squeaking, all some months after purchase) as well as genuine claims engine faults, leaks etc. so because of this, used vehicle costs have to go up and be fixed to cover the risk cost of warranty claims.

If people make after sales claims, however minor they seem to a dealership, and the claims are honoured, it would perhaps be a struggle to argue said claims were not genuine (“goodwill” arguments or otherwise)… and if the cost of said minor repairs has already been factored in and borne by the customer within a sale price (ie a premium has been charged for the privilege of buying from any dealer), then perhaps understandably, customer expectations might be high - they might try everything they can to meet their value for money expectations. Similar to a dealer trying everything they can to make the best profit they can from each sale. Works both ways and yet, would be surprised if many dealers worth their salt operate at losses on any or too many vehicle sales.

Last edited by pld118 on 26th Dec 2022 3:48pm. Edited 1 time in total

Wow, JayGee, you’re a salesman’s dream!

I didn’t think society had moved on as far as accepting the first price you’re given, without any room for negotiation.

Does that also apply to, say, buying a house? Got - 2017 SDV8 Autobiography in Loire Blue
Had- 2008 TDV8 Vogue SE in Java black
Had - 2007 S/C in Stornoway Grey

pld118 wrote:

If people make after sales claims, however minor they seem to a dealership, and the claims are honoured, it would perhaps be a struggle to argue said claims were not genuine (“goodwill” arguments or otherwise)… and if the cost of said minor repairs has already been factored in and borne by the customer within a sale price (ie a premium has been charged for the privilege of buying from any dealer), then perhaps understandably, customer expectations might be high - they might try everything they can to meet their value for money expectations. Similar to a dealer trying everything they can to make the best profit they can from each sale. Works both ways and yet, would be surprised if many dealers worth their salt operate at losses on any or too many vehicle sales.

Interesting thread this. I’ve always understood the sticker price on a car was what is technically called an invitation to treat, in other words an opening position in a negotiation. The final sale price is the figure agreed as acceptable between the two parties. Often the dealer will claim no room to move on the price, but will throw in other things ‘gratis’ to keep the headline number. My starting point when talking to sales people is to as how much they want to earn from the car and how that earning is made up. If they won’t share that, I just walk away. Sometimes though, if the car is just what you’re looking for and the price seems OK to you, you pony up so as not to lose the deal.

For the last 2-3 years at least, more with some brands, the sticker price is just the same as a supermarket or corner shop sticker price - that's what it will cost if you want to buy it. Would you ask a shop owner how much profit is in a tin of beans compared to a tin of all day breakfast? Would you object if I asked you if you thought were worth what you were paid - and how much?. Why would any employee divulge commercially sensitive information to someone that may well be on a fishing expedition from a competitor? it's also against their conditions of employment.

There's a few brands moving to the agency model, for new cars only at the moment - the price is set by the importer and is a national price, I don't think it'll be long before trade-ins are given the same treatment. Other brands, such as Volvo, are favouring the subscription model.

With dealerships now selling used cars of an age that they'd previously have sent to auction - entirely due to the lack of new cars driving up the value of older ones, I think they'll want to keep hold of ownership of the metal and herd buyers into more of a fixed-cost lease model, there's rumours of a bulk rework facility a German manufacturer is looking at, essentially new seat coverings, carpets and doorcards, switchgear etc. for the interior with remanufactured power, drivetrain & suspension components fitted to a repainted bodyshell. I'm not sure there will be a big enough market for new-ish models at old-ish prices, if it happens at all but I can see the attraction of having a manufacturer rebuilt car over something of a similar age that has had 'just enough' maintenance to scrape through MoT's.

alanm_3 wrote:

Wow, JayGee, you’re a salesman’s dream!

I didn’t think society had moved on as far as accepting the first price you’re given, without any room for negotiation.

Does that also apply to, say, buying a house?

If you lived in Scotland that’s exactly how you’d buy a house, we operate on an “offers over” system where people will offer what they are willing to pay, often up to 10-20% over the asking price in desirable areas.
Your corner shop analogy is exactly what I described in my previous reply. Goods, when new have a fixed value, whereas used car prices are set by the dealer.
I rather think we’re going to have to agree to disagree on this topic, as I stick by my belief that there should be some negotiation in the used car market. Got - 2017 SDV8 Autobiography in Loire Blue
Had- 2008 TDV8 Vogue SE in Java black
Had - 2007 S/C in Stornoway Grey

I looked at an £70,000 car at my local dealer and they would drop the price by £200. Not much, but if you don't ask you don't get.
They had had the car on the forecourt for five weeks and said if it didn't sell within a six week period it would go to auction.
If I think a car is over priced I wouldn't look at it in the first place.