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adara

Member Since: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Eastern Europe
Posts: 766

2019 Range Rover Vogue 2.0 PHEV Santorini Black

First test drive impressions

Soo… Finally a test drive… After unwillingly skipping the first invitation (about a month ago) (away for a short Spanish vacation) …

Anyway, looks are great, much leaner and fresher than the L405, but most of the time you watch it from the inside, right?
Finish is simple, clean and modern. Front seats are comfortable, the cushions are a little harder, but certainly shorter. Steering wheel is nice looking, but the old one was much more pleasant to use IMHO, there was room to hold the hands at 16 and 20h, I liked that, it's not possible anymore… The shiny touch panels are even larger and as difficult to use as the old ones. Scratch that, harder to use, as layout is different.

The new dashboard is smaller than the previous, but pushed forward, so I had the same feeling as with the new camera rear view mirror, the eyes need to adjust to the smaller distance… If you used it, you know the feeling... There is a focus mode for the dash, didn’t like it, so I switched to the classic view, two dials. Head up display is identical to the current one.

The center screen is large, has good contrast, CarPlay is displayed in 5x2 nicely spaced icon rows and there is still space for menus on the side. It’s curved and shiny and all the fingerprints on the planet are visible, I guess because they switched from Panasonic to LG (Panasonic used to brag about how fingerprint proof their screen is)? Screen speed is still jittery, the high resolution could be the cause? This floating screen is an acquired taste, but it does its job. The dual screen setup was useful for displaying different stuff (map/media/terrain response), but I didn't miss it as much as I feared. The suspension controls are on the display only now, as are the advanced seat controls (but at least their menu pops up as soon as you touch the door buttons). I really don’t like the new windows switch position, maybe my hands are long, but I had trouble reaching them, as I kept hitting the rear part of the door with the elbow… The climate panel is all right, the new vents are much smaller and I suppose that’s why they put some new ones on the dash, à la L355… Airflow seemed quieter than the actual one, I liked the “unmovable” fins. But the seat cooling is so noisy, it's distracting! Upper glovebox is similar, lower one is smaller, if that was possible!

Wireless Airplay worked fine, first a Bluetooth connection is required, some codes are exchanged and then it just pops everytime in seconds. No map display on the dash or the HUD though… There is a Qi charging pad under a drawer in the centre console, also a second drawer with cupholders and a fridge with another small (wallet?) holder, overall, the storage space seemed even less than before… All USB connectors are C, no lighter socket in front (who uses those), but there is one behind the console for the rear seats (with 2 USB C and a 220V socket). I fear for the drawer mechanisms, as I do for the cupholders between the rear seats, that are complicated and plasticky.

The front side windows are small and useless, but give an “airier” feeling, as the front trims (and the side ones too) are black now. The tweeter occupies 1/3 of that window and they moved the midrange speaker on the upper dash corners…

They said that the sound system is the middle trim, I didn’t like the sound, tried to adjust (the DTS and Dolby options are gone, replaced by Stereo, Meridian Trifield and Meridian Trifield 3D), but no matter what I changed, it didn’t sound as good as my system, which is Meridian Surround and is awesome! I also found only 2 speakers in the rear doors…

Visors are similar, but the vanity mirror covers do not slide anymore (it was cool), now they flip.

Windscreen wiper washers are integrated in the wipers now, à la I-Pace.
The wipers washer reservoir is huge, almost the whole length of the side panel!

Click image to enlarge

Fun fact, on both sides, you can reach the upper wheel protection trim from above!

Rear seats comfort is improved, mostly because they are not as flat as the previous ones, you don't slide anymore, the reason being that, when the seatbacks are folded (with a 30-40% speed improvement, I must say), the front part of the seat cushion is also lowered, allowing the back to travel a little more. This doesn’t mean that the loading surface becomes flat, though… I fiddled with the dealer to figure how the ski hatch is opened, our conclusion is that it’s an option that this car didn’t have, although it really seemed to… The button simply doesn’t exist…

There are new “retro” grab handles and the mechanism is delicate and veery complicated… There is a foldable coat hanger included (the old one is still there) and gone are the funky reading lights. Just regular ones. Rear doors had electric sun blinds, pretty cool, but the rear door pillar (B) is huge, about 10 cm I think, dealer said because of the mechanism, but I don’t think so. The door controls, relocated too, are similar to the present ones. Didn't see blind spot door warning lights for the passengers, but does anyone check them? Door pockets are smaller, as are the pockets behind the front seats. No Click and Go Base anymore, JLR seem to give up on them.

The rear climate was not independent, it’s hard now to find out what trim the car has. And no funky unmovable fins in the back... Also, I didn’t find the small drawer that my car has, it was pointless anyway, but yet another missing storage space… BTW, there still isn’t a sunglasses compartment!
The floor in the back is not flat anymore, therefore there are separate mats there.

Click image to enlarge

The trunk seemed similar in volume to the current one, there is an extra storage space on the left side, but it hasn’t got a net, only the right one has a tiny one… The car had a fragile and hard to operate backrest/divider, the idea is nice, but I don’t think it will last long, it’s really flimsy… Not as flimsy as the electric trunk cover, though, it was already broken. The dealer said that everyone forgets and tries to pull it, so it gets out of alignment and freezes… Also, it doesn’t have the spring enabled flap in the front anymore, so there’s always a minimum 10 cm space behind the rear seats… And it’s a 400-euro option! There are curry hooks now and improved lighting (1 more light). Also a shiny panel for the annoying electric cover and lower/raise suspension.

Click image to enlarge

Rear lights are very cool, not sure about the turn signals, it’s more like a 2005 Honda Civic gimmick, if only the whole width of the bar would light up, now that would have been awesome!

Now, about driving. It was a 300 diesel, compared to my PHEV, it seemed slower and lazier. The noise is reduced though, mostly the engine noise, road noise is still present and mostly in the back, of course. I think they soundproofed the firewall better. Windows, although laminated, are not thicker. Dealer said all RR’s have the noise masking software, I don’t know about that, for sure it didn’t have speakers in the headrests or in the ceiling. The rear steering helps in tight corners, not much, but you feel it. We turned a few times in a deserted roundabout at high speed and it was fun. And scary.

To me, the ride seemed a little more detached, had less roll, but I still had to enable Dynamic mode and it still behaved like the big boat it is! Didn’t look for consumption, there was a promise of a weekend loan and we’ll see then. The fuel flap is huge, probably to fit the AdBlue filler under it too…
The new gear selector is OK, but I still like the round one. The P button has to be pressed to put it in park. There still is no way to tell the position, except for the dash or LED’s. Oh, and the start button is on the center console now. One needs to get used to that.

The overall finish is good, I can’t say if it is improved over the current one, but it’s not worse. The original reactions over quality, confirmed by the dealer, were probably due to the finish of the prototypes. The new wood is actually very nice, also the chocolate interior was cool.

The turn signal click is very quiet, you barely hear it now.

Well, is it better than the current one? For an increase in price of 40000 euro (over here), it better be. As I still have a 2 years extended warranty on mine, there’s really no need to switch, going back to mine didn’t feel like driving a tractor. Not at all…

Last edited by adara on 3rd May 2022 6:26pm. Edited 6 times in total

3rd May 2022 1:14pm

Eirik34

Member Since: 16 Dec 2014
Location: Norway
Posts: 437

First - thanks for a great review, adara!

Was it a SE or HSE version you were testing? I guess not an AB variant, due to the lack of the Signature sound system.

adara wrote:
The turn signal click is very quiet, you barely hear it now.

That is actually very good news, I think! The L405 had quite loud, distinct and artificial turn signal, IMO.

3rd May 2022 1:59pm

EdJ

Member Since: 30 Jan 2015
Location: London
Posts: 340

Great review, thanks very much! One of the most informative I've seen so far, although a few disappointments (such as the lack of sunglasses holder!)

I especially appreciated the comments on Apple CarPlay, as I do currently use this a lot in my L405. It is a shame that using CarPlay renders much of the tech redundant. For example, the head up display or dashboard cannot show the Apple sat nav, the tech that adopts the hybrid engine to the conditions (similar to what is on the current PHEV) won't work, the anti-roll is said to anticipate corners using the sat nav, so presumably won't work with CarPlay either.

I also think that CarPlay makes the screen look a little cluttered with the doubling up of the icons at the side.

Is the standard sat nav in the car any good? I'd use it if it came close to the options on CarPlay (with alerts for speed cameras, traffic updates etc). 2024 Range Rover P550e AB

3rd May 2022 4:09pm

adara

Member Since: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Eastern Europe
Posts: 766

Quote:
First - thanks for a great review, adara!

Thank you for your kind comment, I'm just another user, probably a future user of an L460, so there are things that I'm interested in and that are overseen in "fancy" reviews in magazines or online...

Quote:
Was it a SE or HSE version you were testing? I guess not an AB variant, due to the lack of the Signature sound system.

I already messaged the dealer about that and will be back with an answer, like I said, the new models do not show the trim level, I would suspect S, there was not much on that car, but it did feature both a heat resistant and heated windshield, which helps the AC a lot! I know, mine's only heated...

Quote:
That is actually very good news, I think! The L405 had quite loud, distinct and artificial turn signal, IMO.

You are right, it is loud! However, I noticed the sound comes from the holes above the dash screen, I'm thinking about putting some self-adhesive foam over them? Covering them with a rag muted the sound...

Last edited by adara on 3rd May 2022 5:12pm. Edited 1 time in total

3rd May 2022 4:56pm

DrF

Member Since: 30 Jun 2014
Location: South East
Posts: 1386

2013 Range Rover SVAutobiography 5.0 SC V8 Orkney Grey

All new L460 have a the trim level in the windscreen next to the vin number as well as engine size on the screen cut out

3rd May 2022 5:01pm

adara

Member Since: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Eastern Europe
Posts: 766

Quote:
Great review, thanks very much! One of the most informative I've seen so far, although a few disappointments (such as the lack of sunglasses holder!)

Thank you, you are very kind! The lack of sunglasses holder was a 5 euro fix on the current model, by replacing the hand grab on the driver side with a Ford case... I'm afraid that on the new one it won't be that easy because of the thin "retro" handles...

Quote:
I especially appreciated the comments on Apple CarPlay, as I do currently use this a lot in my L405. It is a shame that using CarPlay renders much of the tech redundant. For example, the head up display or dashboard cannot show the Apple sat nav, the tech that adopts the hybrid engine to the conditions (similar to what is on the current PHEV) won't work, the anti-roll is said to anticipate corners using the sat nav, so presumably won't work with CarPlay either.

You are right, there is a lack of integration that is hard to understand.

Quote:
I also think that CarPlay makes the screen look a little cluttered with the doubling up of the icons at the side.

Again, you are right. LG's IVI car OS, (or PIVI Pro as it's known at JLR) is completely different. The symbols are small and hard to see/use in the car. CarPlay is much friendlier...

Quote:
Is the standard sat nav in the car any good? I'd use it if it came close to the options on CarPlay (with alerts for speed cameras, traffic updates etc).

From what I saw (by taking a picture of and entering the VIN

here: https://www.landrover.com/ownership/incont...nload.html
the new model has the same here.com maps that are available for my car and that are crap!
I stick with Waze... Has all of that + Police, roadworks, etc.

Last edited by adara on 3rd May 2022 7:28pm. Edited 3 times in total

3rd May 2022 5:11pm

adara

Member Since: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Eastern Europe
Posts: 766

DrF wrote:
All new L460 have a the trim level in the windscreen next to the vin number as well as engine size on the screen cut out

Thank you, you are right! It was a D350 HSE! Didn't catch that...

Click image to enlarge

3rd May 2022 5:17pm

7 CDB

Member Since: 18 Dec 2017
Location: Lincoln
Posts: 134

2017 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV6 Loire Blue

What a great, honest and relevant review 👍👍

Thank you

3rd May 2022 5:28pm

LeunamRR

Member Since: 26 Oct 2013
Location: Torres Vedras
Posts: 75

Adara
Thanks for charing your views and with such detail.

3rd May 2022 5:44pm

adara

Member Since: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Eastern Europe
Posts: 766

7 CDB wrote:
What a great, honest and relevant review 👍👍

Thank you

Thank you! I tried to detail the things reviewers never seem to mention...

3rd May 2022 6:12pm

adara

Member Since: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Eastern Europe
Posts: 766

LeunamRR wrote:
Adara
Thanks for charing your views and with such detail.

My pleasure!

3rd May 2022 6:13pm

CS

Member Since: 14 Apr 2015
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 1373

2017 Range Rover Autobiography 5.0 SC V8 Corris Grey

Adara, many thanks for posting.

I hope you don't mind me adding some likes and dislikes from my recent test drive, also D350 HSE, 23" wheels. Comparison is with 405 5.0SC 2017.

Likes:

- there was a sense of occasion and I really enjoyed driving the car, there was almost a sensation of wanting to go faster for the fun of it;

- handling and response to poor surfaces, tighter turning circle, the rear wheel steering felt fine;

- more 'top of the travel' brake response, i.e. more like 332 and earlier RRs than 405;

- quiet and refined, no speakers in headrest so I put this down to better noise insulation in body/wheel arches rather than noise cancelling technology, I'm not sure if that is right;

- audio seemed better than standard 405 AB system (non-signature), also notably better DAB radio reception;

- seats more pillowy than 2017 MY 405, the headrest seemed further back though, I didn't spend long trying to adjust so maybe this can be changed;

- the D350 engine was powerful enough, and nice progressive delivery, maybe not quite as punchy as 5.0SC, but probably suits the car better.

I'm pretty hopeless on tech so didn't try anything other than the radio. I did notice that reversing camera screen definition was improved too.

Dislikes:

- one seems to have to raise and lower the suspension through the screen. Maybe this would be quicker with practice, but I found it a really annoying faff, as I often raise and lower the car, say on entering and leaving a rough track, a field or whatever. The rocker button in the 405 (and earlier) is much better;

- the new gear lever not including a 'park' position so one has to press the button beside it (one would get used to it soon enough);

- the door handle is too far forward, so less efficient to reach and operate;

- steering wheel makes a tinny noise if one taps on it, the seam around it makes for a less pleasant feel in the hand and the two tone perlino/black version in the car I had would be hard to keep clean, and if not clean would look nasty. I also didn't like the shiny buttons which show finger marks very prominently (unlike the matt buttons of the 405). The cruise control buttons were a bit fiddly;

- some finishes were inferior, this is maybe an HSE v AB thing. The headlining was a sort of perforated synthetic cloth over foam effect, maybe good for noise reduction, but felt much less nice than my leather headlining. It was particularly noticeable in the feel of the sun visor, which I didn't like at all. I'd definitely want to have the SV leather headlining which was a no cost option on AB when last I looked;

- the grab handles above the doors feel much less substantial and don't have the pleasing damped rollback of the 405, also seem always just to be black with chrome ends, so no colour matching to headlining;

- less door storage than 405;

- dash cover and stitching seemed a bit less 'premium' than 2017 AB, as did the plastic speaker at the front top of the door card;

Not a test drive item, but I also don't like that one can only have a deployable towbar, rather than the simpler and more reliable farmer's hitch I have now.

A final negative is that when I configured a car to more or less match what I have now (albeit better audio is standard on AB on the L460) the price came to £142,500 or so.

While the L460 is an improvement, it is not a huge leap forward compared with the 405, and for me it is certainly not £90,000 odd better than my current car. I'd be happy to replace my 405 with a 460 when the time is right, and will watch with interest what happens as regards the petrol V8, but don't feel the need to order one right away. Only Range Rovers since 1988

3rd May 2022 6:56pm

Freddy Bear

Member Since: 10 Jan 2019
Location: London
Posts: 146

Adara huge thanks for taking the time to write such a helpful review!

Do you know if your test drive car had the new fancy dampers?

Your comments really resonated - I have driven a LWB D350 AB and sent some notes afterwards to my dealer - pasting them below in case of interest.

Worth saying that I have read enough posts on LinkedIn to know that everyone who has worked on the new car is very proud of the result, and so they should be. Plus it brings much needed design, engineering and manufacturing jobs to the UK so all credit to them. Any suggestions below are ‘for the facelift’ and take nothing away from their achievements!

Things I liked:

- you feel you are in something new and special (it reminds me of my first go in an L405)
- the ride quality is much improved; very smooth and beautifully damped
- the seats are softer and more comfortable
- the sound system is just awesome!
- to my surprise I liked the new gear selector (and I can see it is safer)
- cameras are much improved
- you don’t notice it is a LWB when driving really (the rear wheel steer helps a lot)
- I like the simplified seat controls as they are easier to use
- wireless CarPlay, thank you!
- not originally my engine of choice but very impressed by the D350 and I would consider it now
- the fridge area is much better (I can never remember which lever opens which part on mine)
- space for keys, drinks and wireless phone charging - yay!
- well done to whoever decides what goes in an AB in the UK, in particular HUD as standard on an AB is a big step forward

Jobs for the facelift:

- Please check wind noise. I found there was a lot of wind noise around the windscreen, audible above the stereo, which I had on loud. I drove the same road in my L405 later (the wind seemed the same) and it was noticeably less noisy. I wondered if I had a window open or the sunroof open but all seemed closed.
- Please ask your friends at Land Rover to put the arm rest ability on the door card back 🙂If you drive with your right elbow on the top of the door card in an L405 (which I do) you will find this much harder in the L460 because the surface slopes inwards so my elbow kept slipping off.
- Please improve the climate buttons (ie between the two dials). I expect a tactile and ergonomic delight from such parts of the car but these were a disappointment. I thought they were touch sensitive but they seem to require a very firm press of the whole panel which surprised me, and not in a good way.
- Please allow the selection of both side cameras at the same time. The most used camera view (in my humble opinion) is both sides of the car at once (for parking, avoiding the curbs in a car park, or going through a toll booth, or through a width restriction). I couldn’t summons that view except in the off-road setting.
- Please improve the steering wheel controls. Some controls (eg volume) are a stretch now which means you have to take your eyes off the road to use them.
- Please put the leather back on the sun visors; everyone who has had a RR will notice that!
- Please make the indicator click a little louder; I couldn't hear it at all with the stereo on at modest levels, so had to visually check it was on.
- Please add an alert if you open the door with your phone on the charger.
- Please find a better location for the internal door lock / unlock buttons. They are a stretch to reach and hard to see.
- Please improve the external door handles. The handles don’t feel luxurious, and really surprised me
- Please enable the HUD to show navigation instructions from CarPlay 🙂
- Above all, please consider including some previous RR customers in some sort of panel to provide input to the car’s detail design - I am sure things like the arm resting on the door cards would be picked up by owners and that would help the design process.

The car I drove:

3rd May 2022 7:07pm

adara

Member Since: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Eastern Europe
Posts: 766

Quote:
Adara, many thanks for posting.

I hope you don't mind me adding some likes and dislikes from my recent test drive, also D350 HSE, 23" wheels. Comparison is with 405 5.0SC 2017.

My pleasure, don't mind at all, on the contrary!

Quote:
Likes:

- there was a sense of occasion and I really enjoyed driving the car, there was almost a sensation of wanting to go faster for the fun of it;

- handling and response to poor surfaces, tighter turning circle, the rear wheel steering felt fine;

- more 'top of the travel' brake response, i.e. more like 332 and earlier RRs than 405;

Agree to all of your impressions.

Quote:
- quiet and refined, no speakers in headrest so I put this down to better noise insulation in body/wheel arches rather than noise cancelling technology, I'm not sure if that is right;

I mentioned one can touch the upper arch liner, from above, it's really just the same textile insulation we have now... I read somewhere that the firewall was completely redesigned.

Quote:
- audio seemed better than standard 405 AB system (non-signature), also notably better DAB radio reception;

Not sure about that, didn't like the sound, it was OK, but not as punchy as in the current Meridian surround system...

Quote:
- seats more pillowy than 2017 MY 405, the headrest seemed further back though, I didn't spend long trying to adjust so maybe this can be changed;

Seat cushions seemed harder to me, but in a good way. I am positive they are shorter, but this is not a problem, the current ones are too long, really. Indeed, the headrest didn't move forward that much, I tried.

Quote:
- the D350 engine was powerful enough, and nice progressive delivery, maybe not quite as punchy as 5.0SC, but probably suits the car better.

It's great, silent and responsive, but I'm used to the hybrid where the electric motor gives an extra kick. The PHEV will be awesome!

Quote:
I'm pretty hopeless on tech so didn't try anything other than the radio. I did notice that reversing camera screen definition was improved too.

The screen is larger, but the definition seemed about the same as the post facelift one.

Quote:
Dislikes:

- one seems to have to raise and lower the suspension through the screen. Maybe this would be quicker with practice, but I found it a really annoying faff, as I often raise and lower the car, say on entering and leaving a rough track, a field or whatever. The rocker button in the 405 (and earlier) is much better;

Absolutely right about that, the utilitarian features of the car are completely pushed to the screen menus now!

Quote:
- the new gear lever not including a 'park' position so one has to press the button beside it (one would get used to it soon enough);

That was a surprise for me too.

Quote:
- the door handle is too far forward, so less efficient to reach and operate;

Completely agree with that. And the controls are, at least for me, harder to access. But I don't use them that often to be a problem.

Quote:
- steering wheel makes a tinny noise if one taps on it, the seam around it makes for a less pleasant feel in the hand and the two tone perlino/black version in the car I had would be hard to keep clean, and if not clean would look nasty. I also didn't like the shiny buttons which show finger marks very prominently (unlike the matt buttons of the 405). The cruise control buttons were a bit fiddly;

Also the shape is unfriendly. The control panels are not intuitive and need your attention when used. As for the cruise control setup, I don't understand, why does it have to be so complicated? Even VW or Renault have intuitive cruise controls!

Quote:
- some finishes were inferior, this is maybe an HSE v AB thing. The headlining was a sort of perforated synthetic cloth over foam effect, maybe good for noise reduction, but felt much less nice than my leather headlining. It was particularly noticeable in the feel of the sun visor, which I didn't like at all. I'd definitely want to have the SV leather headlining which was a no cost option on AB when last I looked;

Headlining and visor trim are the same as in my current car (Vogue SE)

Quote:
- the grab handles above the doors feel much less substantial and don't have the pleasing damped rollback of the 405, also seem always just to be black with chrome ends, so no color matching to headlining;

They are somehow damped but look like they won't last 10 years...

Quote:
- less door storage than 405;

Less storage everywhere, why?

Quote:
While the L460 is an improvement, it is not a huge leap forward compared with the 405, and for me it is certainly not £90,000 odd better than my current car. I'd be happy to replace my 405 with a 460 when the time is right, and will watch with interest what happens as regards the petrol V8, but don't feel the need to order one right away.

Completely agree, the difference is not the one between L322 and L405, for instance.

4th May 2022 8:00am

EdJ

Member Since: 30 Jan 2015
Location: London
Posts: 340

One question for those who have test driven the car, they made a big noise about "Alexa" being included as standard in the L460. What can Alexa do / not do? For example, can you ask Alexa to "lower the car"? Or "increase lumbar support in driver's seat"?

I hate having to go into a screen to change anything, but if Alexa is able to perform these features, it might be at the very least, a safer option. 2024 Range Rover P550e AB

4th May 2022 8:17am

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