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Bean19844



Member Since: 25 Oct 2020
Location: Essex
Posts: 929

United Kingdom 2006 Range Rover Supercharged 4.2 SC V8 Bonatti Grey

Craig.

My 4.2 had the exact same. I seem to get the impression that super charged and turbo charged vehicles are struggling with the e10 increased meth there fore as its using more fuel then what its used to it throws up the fault codes. Soon as you run super unleaded tesco momentum in my case, it's using the correct volume of meth therefore won't need to use more petrol and run lean. I've suggested to a lot of my friends that run on boosted cars too try this.

Another way too find out would be to fill a car up with e10 fuel and run this around while using live data so can see what the injectors are doing then look at what they did previously before the e10 change or try it on various forms of super unleaded petrol and re read the live data

Post #608188 4th Oct 2021 2:13pm
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Merchy



Member Since: 14 Feb 2021
Location: North Wales
Posts: 1181

United Kingdom 2006 Range Rover Vogue Td6 Zermatt Silver

Had a look at some of these octane boosters, some of which seem to aimed primarily at motor sport. One point I noticed is that most of them shy away from definitively declaring that the product is safe with catalytic converters and other systems. Therefore if I were you Sir, I would just top up when you have some room in the tank.
Especially as the boss's SC is probably in tip top condition Sir Thumbs Up

Not an expert on this, JMC in the above post will most likely know a LOT more than me on this subject.

Post #608198 4th Oct 2021 3:28pm
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JMC



Member Since: 01 Feb 2009
Location: Aberdeen-Angus
Posts: 755

Scotland 2012 Range Rover Westminster TDV8 Orkney Grey

Interestingly, fuel crisis aside (not applicable in my neck of the woods anyway), the only fuel shortages I've seen here in recent weeks have been padlocks on the super unleaded pumps. This has been nothing to do with tanker deliveries and all to do with a sudden increase in super unleaded sales which has caught the retailers with their pants down. I wonder why..... Laughing The older I get, the more I realise that people confuse wrinkles for wisdom Smile

Post #608202 4th Oct 2021 4:06pm
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northernmonkeyjones



Member Since: 24 Mar 2012
Location: derby
Posts: 8508

United Kingdom 2016 Range Rover Autobiography SDV8 Santorini Black

Swmbos Fiat seems fine on the new E10, but I’m not going to put it in my ‘98 M3, pretty sure that likes super best anyway….. There is nothing that can't be fixed with a hammer😜😜
FFRR 4.4 SDV8 Autobiography Santorini Black.
Fiat 500x 1.4 multiair Lounge 2015
2010 LR D4 Commercial 2.7 TDV6

Post #608207 4th Oct 2021 4:48pm
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appj62



Member Since: 07 Aug 2013
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 424

England 2006 Range Rover Vogue SE 4.2 SC V8 Buckingham Blue

I'm going to have to put the new stuff in mine, in the next week or so. It's going to be a case of sucking it and seeing what the outcome is. Not upset SWMBOs micra yet. Previous cars:
S-Max 2007-2013 (only diesel I've had, good car but expensive when diesely bits go wrong, so what's the point?)
Galaxy 2001-2007
Mondeo Estate 1997-2001
Sierra Estate 1993-1997
Uno Turbo 1987 -1993
Fiesta 1984 - 1987
Fiat 127 1982 - 1984

Post #608224 4th Oct 2021 6:29pm
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Weejock



Member Since: 30 Dec 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 417

2002 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Epsom Green

No expert here but I looked into fueling a long time ago when running an import Japanese spec. motor which would have been runnning on 100RON fuel back in Japan.

Ethanol is actually used to increase the octane rating, like other alcohols, and it's RON rating is typically higher.
You can get better performance out of higher Ethanol content fuels (like E85), especially with forced induction engines, because the resistance to knock is higher (higher RON). There are other performance benefits to as well..top fuel dragsters run on alcohol for a reason.
The problems with Ethanol are:

    1) It's calorific value is less than standard gasoline, in other words it contains less energy. So to get the equivalent energy from it you need to burn more hence the fuel economy suffers. As we are coming from only 5% content to 10% content then the fuel economy difference should not be massively different, perhaps 5% at most. If you were switching to E85 from standard gasolline then it would be about 15% to 27% difference for example.

    2) Ethanol is a solvent and is corrosive to metals although additive packs are included in fuels to reduce this. The Ethanol will clean out fuel tanks, pipes etc. and also can eat through certain seals and pipe materials although that really only affects older vehicies, in general, post '02 vehicles should have been manufactured with Ethanol resistant materials and post '10 vehicles should have no problems at all.
    The cleaning nature of Ethanol can lead to clogged fuel filters fairly quickly early on, once the system has been cleaned through then it shouldn't be a problem. Lean codes could be the result of clogged filters or a previous near lean condition which the E10 has sent it over the edge into error.

    3) Ethanol is hygroscopic, it has an affinitity towards water and will pull moisture out of the air. If left Ethanol will combine with water and separate out from the rest of the fuel. It is not recommended to use higher Ethanol content fuels in vehicles that are likely to be left for months on end unused as condensation can build in fuel tanks, especially if PCV systems are not sealing the tank properly, and end up with poor fuel with lower octane sat on a pool of ethanol/water underneath it. Given the fuel pump sits near the bottom of the tank I'll let you decide how an engine would run on it! For everyday use though it's not a problem, for over wintered garaged classics it might be.

Again it's not recommended to use E10 in petrol engine tools like mowers etc. especially if they are left to sit over winter with fuel in the carb, it wll cause fuel gelling, corrosion and poor or non-running the following season from the moisture. Use E5 or drain out the carb and tank before storing.
There was a good Youtube series of videos ran over a year testing 'fuel stabilisers' mixed with standard E10 pump fuel and it proved they did nothing to prevent corrosion of the carb and eventual non running of the engine. The only one that came out looking like brand new at the end was not even a fuel stabiliser, it was just a fuel with no ethanol in it at all.

You can use Ethanols affinity to water to actually remove it from the fuel. Add water to the fuel, shake and mix the water through and then let it sit to settle. Ethanol and water combine and will sit at the bottom of the container under the fuel and it can then be drawn off. There are plenty of Youtube videos showing this process.
If the intention is then to use the fuel after removing the Ethanol then an Octane booster maybe required as Ethanol is part of the RON boosting package. Xlyene is often used as the main constituent of Octane boosters.
I'm certanly not suggesting anyone try it, just an interesting experiment and a way of checking the ethanol content of fuel.

Personally I've just filled up with E10 in my '02 M62 4.4 and it seemed to run OK. If it starts messing around within the next few weeks I'll swap out the fuel filter, reset the fuel trims (battery disconnect) and try again.
If it's still an issue then it's going to be on E5 Super Unleaded, I personally wouldn't mess around with additives.

Post #608356 5th Oct 2021 4:02pm
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