Hi all,

My td6 has developed a problem - it has become difficult to start but spins over well. The day the problem started it got to a busy part of my commute and it stalled coming to a stop, it wouldnt restart for around 20 minutes but when it did it drove home ok. I *think* I unusually went full throttle a few times on the journey previously if this could in any way contribute?

I presume it is a fuelling issue but where do I start in fault finding? If it was an in tanl pump I presume it wouldnt have stalled on me?

Thanks for any help!

Leak test on injectors would be first thought, few threads on that.

Sound like in-tank fuel pump to me, mine stalled / died when the pump started failing and took a while to restart.
Did you get an error messge thrown up on the display?
I got 'Fuel injector syst' or something similar, when my old TD6 started having problems with the pump.
Also how much fuel did you have in the tank at the time? It will die if there's not enough in the tank to fill the catch pot in the sender unit in the tank without the pump running.
Don't go out and buy a whole new fuel sender unit (in tank) if it is the problem, they're about £400 odd for the full unit. You can get a replacement pump alone off fleabay for £35 odd, take the unit out of the tank, disassemble it and replace the pump alone. Did that on mine and sorted it.
I even taught my local indy mechanic this as he had the same problem on his old TD6 at the same time as mine, but he had already forked out for a new sender unit. Needless to say he was a bit at the cost.

Hope this helps.

There's also a secondary in line pump that sits under the N/S/R passenger seat, it's accessible by a removable panel under the car and is actually quite easy to change, if thats your problem. It went on mine and took some finding as it was intermittent and didn't give any fault codes. Would drive faultless for weeks on end, then I'd go in a shop, come back and it wouldn't start.

Thanks for the replies so far!

I had around 20L in the tank, so may contribute? I have no errors showing on the dash (at least for the starting issue..i'll start another thread/search for my suspension!)

Are the in tank pumps accessible on these or do i have to drop a tank/cut some floorplan like i did on the P38 for the same problem?

The secondary pump also looks fairly simple, how can i fault find between them?

I will search RE leak test, thanks!

I don't know about the secondary pump under the car but Discotigger has a good point for the in tank pump.

This link may help with access and info, but I am not sure if the in tank connections problem would be applicable to a 2004 TD6. On mine, 2011 TDV8, the main pump went walkabout in the tank and fell over, legs in the air like a dead beetle. It still worked but was giving a daft range readings and then threw up a pump fault on the dash.

https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/topic41061.html

If you find it is the in tank pump come back and I'll try to help with reference to my repair. Cheers
Richard

(there are no such things as an ordinary FullFat, an ordinary cat or too many tools)
2011 TDV8 Vogue Santorini Black
Gap IIDBT

If you only had 20 litres in the tank, then it does sound like an in-tank pump problem.
You don't have to get under the car to access the in-tank fuel sender unit, but it does mean having to lift the rear seatsa and carpet.
There is a youtube video that shows what to do, it is for a petrol version Rangie, but it's the same as for a diesel.

Ideally get a scanner on it. Maybe no faults. But see what the fuel pressures are when the pumps if the pumps are priming and also with engine running

With your hand on the pump you should feel them run when you cycle the ignition

Anything over 3.5 bar with ign on is ok. 5 bar is perfect
Engine running I think is 350 bar at tickover.

Thanks guys, hopefully my icarsoft scans well enough

Mine went the same way. Check for fuel delivery at the high pressure fuel rail pump when it won't start. No fuel being delivered there then then there's a fair chance it's the electric inline fuel pump. I had that replaced and it has been fine ever since. Good luck.

I've just been out and checked the flow from the outlet of the filter when cycling the ignition - I get around 400ml(ish!) pretty quickly, seems like a good flow leading me to believe the electric pump(s) are probably working well enough?

my icarsoft LR2 is refusing to link to the engine ECU unfortunately... so i'm unable to check the pressure at this point.

I suppose my next port of call is the leak test!

I had similar fault after pumps, still problem and gets worse, about as reliable as the weather! After much grief mine was diagnosed as a sticky injector just one, causing FP to be low and of course computer then says no!

There is a pressure sensor on top of the fuel filter that will show a fault on the dash if the pressure is to low, unplug it and you will see. Saying that I had a problem with the car bogging down under full hard throttle as if it had run out of fuel. No dash warning. After changing the in-tank pump I had no more issues. 2007 TDV8 VSE
2003 TD6 gone.
2002 P38a gone
1999 P38a gone
1997 p38a gone
1993 VSE gone
1992 VSE gone
1966 Series 2a with V8 conversion gone

It really sounds to me like worn carbon brushes in the booster pump. If you disconnect the delivery pipe at the engine bay fuel filter and turn on the ignition the flow has to be at least 100mL per second! If its more like 10mL per second then the in-tank lift pump is pushing fuel through a non running secondary booster pump so that the system appears to be working properly, but the amount and pressure delivered to the fuel filter pressure switch is insufficient to allow starting.

Why is the flow rate so high? Because most of the fuel delivered is used to cool the high pressure mechanical fuel pump built into the engine, then returned to the tank to dissipate the heat. No rapid flow = no rapid cooling = pump wear and premature failure.

A simple test is to rotate the booster pump so that its motor commutator presses against a different part of the brushes; the new contact angle will make good contact to start and run the motor well.

To see if the problem is commutator wear on the electric booster pump here is a simple diagnosis procedure -
The in-line pressure booster pump is beneath the body, under the left rear seat.
Chock the right side wheels and lift the left side of the vehicle onto stands (or just set to off road height if you can then fit under the vehicle (I just can, but won't)
Remove the 2 x m10 screws holding on the plastic access panel, remove the panel and set aside
Remove 2 x phililps screws from the outer plastic sleeve of the motor holder, set the screws aside
Rotate (twist around) the motor in the plastic sleave 90 to 120°
Put the screws and panel back in place
Take the vehicle off the stands and remove the chocks.
Drive as normal.

If the problem goes away then it is the brushes. Order a new pump soonest, the new contact angle will wear the (very) little remaining carbon brush away very quickly.

for more information go here - https://www.fullfatrr.com/forum/post365336.html#365336

bye. 2003 TD6, EGR delete, vortex crankcase breather update, performance chip, UHF 2 way, Android head unit, crash camera on dash, always-on rear view camera to mirror screen, LED DRL`s, Electric trailer brake controller. FSR replaced. Pulling 3T caravan all about Australia

Last edited by bgennette on 9th May 2020 12:25am. Edited 1 time in total