just spent half hour typing this fault and tried to submit it and lost the post

short version

driving down motorway ( in france ) car cut out , dash display fuel injection system, stopped car, restarted drove a bit further , same thing again, just driven 300 k without fault, full tank; still over half full; stopped a further 7 times, each restart would be on the turn of the key,

got into a local garage, ( not dealer ) changed filter, done diagnostic, no faults , left car to run 2 hours, no problem; then fuel line filled with air bubbles, car stopped, same display message,

they checked around and first thought it was the fuel pump at rear of car on passenger side ( which had been changed 2 year before ), but then next day insisted it was main pump;

shipped car to dealer who confirmed main pump fail, next day reported not main but secondary at rear, so changed that

i left with car going home, 100k down road broke down same symptoms same display; Another 7 tiimes; car now stranded in another dealership waiting to be looked at

does anybody have an idea if it would be the main at fault of something else??

im in france and they generally just go around replacing things at the owners cost without any proof that it is actually faulty, which is my concern and im just wary that they will change the pump and it may not solve the problem again and end up getting stuck again,

the only change in the symptoms is that when it first did it the 7 times, it would start straight away, but the last 7 i really had to crank the engine although i did not try just putting the ignition on for a minute and let it prime;

if you have any other views then perhaps i could e mail the garage to ask them to check other things before just replacing the pump;???

i have so far spent 1400e, Of which 800 was charges fo the car to be moved to the garages on a transporter

any ideas and help please guys

bob

Could it be the fuel pump relay? Maybe stopping a restarting kicks it into action.

hi

i have no idea, and dont know if it would show up on a diagnostic check unless it actually failed during the test,

all i know is what i have already paid has not solved the problem, and not being at the garage as it is over 200K away, and not fluent enough to discuss it with them is a concern that they will just replace the main pump at a cost here of around 1500 fitted, and that does not only not need it but will still result in a breakdown again

???

HI GUYS

just a question, i didnt realise there were 3 fuel pumps on the car 2 low and one high; i assume the pump that has been replaced by the dealer is the pump in the little compartment in the chassis just in the area of the passenger rear door; or is this not the secondary pump?

can you tell me what this pump is for ? and where the other low pressure pump is located and the purpose of this one also?

i dont have the invoice handy to check the number of the pump changed but expect it may be different, as it was fitted in france;

but i assume range rover would have done a full diagnostic but my concern is obviously that they have not solved the problem.!!

ah ok

thanks for that; well i believe they have indeed changed the secondary pump, so all i can hope is they will actually come up with a fault code that does actually point to what ever is causing the fault before they change the main pump just for the sake of it !!

its a shame to have to talk like that about the garages if france, but i have had it before with other a main dealer and insisted the FBH was up the shoot and wanted to replace it at a cost of 1700euro, only to find that there was nothing wrong with it and the only reason it did not work is because if was not cold enough for it to come on

thanks again for the pics

bob

You could ask them to swap the relay with the one for the rear heated seats. Same one. In the rear fuse compartment. The main pump won't show any codes when it fails, unfortunately.

Does it run now? AFAIK the pumps fail quite quickly once they start going. Your symptoms don't sound like pump failure.

hi spock

i could ask them to change the relay but as it is an intermittant fault, how could they check? this is the problem;;

i am trying to find out why the previous dealer decided to change the secondary pump a day before, and what made them say this the problem but thy simply wont comment;

i cant see either it sounding like a main pump failure? the car stoped 14 TIMES and each time is started again, initially i went 300k before the first stop, and after i picked it up from the secondary pump change i initially went over a hundred KM before it stopped again, then it was about every 8/10 KM? until i pulled onto the services, i could have continued home another 300k, and just put up with having to stop very 10km etc but i didnt want the problem of driving on single roads with no place to pull over etc;

its almost as if something is getting hot then once it reaches this stage then the issues start ?

all i could do is to tell them to do id run a diagnostic and change the relay and perhaps test the injectors and report back but not to change the main pump; ? then risk driving it back with someone following ?

its all a bit of a concern what with the car some 300 km away in a dealership waiting to be looked at

bob

If it were mine, I'd swap the relay then leave it idling for an hour with the heated seats on. If they switch off, the relay is dying. If it idles for an hour, drive it home and put up with the risk of a breakdown. Keep your credit card and the number of a transport service! Will be cheaper than a pump.

I had similar symptoms. Engine stalled while driving, fuel injection fault displayed and car restarting quite quickly. Happened now and then in the begining, then more frequently. Turned out to be the in tank fuel pump giving up. When it finally gave in the fault would come near half tank every time. Bought just the electric pump (from original manufacturer) and replaced. Cost around 40 GBP+ two hours.

mr_spock wrote:

If it were mine, I'd swap the relay then leave it idling for an hour with the heated seats on. If they switch off, the relay is dying. If it idles for an hour, drive it home and put up with the risk of a breakdown. Keep your credit card and the number of a transport service! Will be cheaper than a pump.

would the fuel tank have to be dropped from the car if i choose to do that or is it accessed from inside the car ?

perhaps for the trouble it would be better to let them do it for what it will cost, but if this in tank pump is failing, would it give the symptoms i have whereby air bubbles suddenly appear in the tube at the filter end ?

bob

just another thought but perhaps it may be the relay, and is failing because it is getting hot ? which would explain that i first was able to drive 300 K BEFORE the first breakdown, and over 100 K on the way back, before it went again, both at high speed spells on the motorway ??

just a

bob

mr_spock wrote:

Could it be the fuel pump relay? Maybe stopping a restarting kicks it into action.

The in-tank fuel pump moves fuel from the LH side of the tank to the RH side were both the in-tank pump and the fuel supply pipe sits. The seconday pump is responsible for the low pressure side delivering fuel from the tank to the filter. If the in-tank fuel pump fails completely it will mean you only get to use half of the tank volume, that it what is in the RH side if the tank since it is a saddle type with one part on eiter side of the rear propshaft. RH here is passenger side on a LHD car.

The in-tank pump is accessed from inside the car, no ned to drop the tank.

If it is the in-tank pump you would be fine to drive the car home as long as you keep it over half full.