Hi Guys/Gals,

I am relatively new to the forum and I have a couple of questions I was hoping for some guidance to:


1)Thinking of changing my LR3 (2006 HSE) to a FFRR (2003/2006ish HSE):

I have a tricked out 2006 LR3 which I rather enjoy (photo below) which I have augmented from a stock HSE myself. However, I have finished my Master's earlier than anticipated and have to move on for my PhD -- consequently, I am trying to recoup some money from my LR3 and buy a less expensive FFRR (I am hoping to realise $19.500 for the LR3). I am also not certain if I should ever have bought the LR3 -- I have never really felt at one with it compared to my earlier Land Rovers, and I was less than impressed at its ability off road (the thing became stuck in only 6 inches of snow, and is a lumber-some heavy oaf off road needing constant fiddling to encourage it to behave; I swear my D2 and Classics would easily have out performed it. In the last 6 months I have also had to pump $16,000 in parts an labour into her -- including a thermostat manifold, complete new air con system, a set of injectors, a new fuel pump, new O2 sensors, two water pumps, front end pulleys, and on and on.... I think my confidence with her has ran out a bit; I remain worried that an older FFRR will reap the same drama.

I have several FFRR options in the Province at the moment: some dealer-owned early 2003s in great condition with about 90,000miles on -- or some private 2005/6 models with a bit higher milage and not so tidy interior/exterior.

One private sale 2006 (Jag) has either a blown head gasket or a blown inlet manifold gasket and is selling cheap because of the work needed (I think I could get it for $10,000 and would need to put $2,500 in parts for the engine job). It only has 70,000miles on it and is in good condition otherwise, but I am curious about why the water issue occurred (serious water combustion with very very minor pressurisation -- perhaps just regular temperature related pressurisation. Lady owner, not raced or rocked, well maintained). All the 2006 vehicles seem to have issues with flaking internal trim and general tattyness inside, but the 03s are excellent all round. Anyone heard of head gasket issues with politely driven vehicles?

Another private option is a 2005 with the BMW engine which is at 100K and has had an used-but-young transmission (fitted, apparently, when Land Rover up some transmission work) and carries with it some additional 3rd party warrantee. Tidy all round, but has the older infotainment system etc. 2nd owner from new; sounds/looks otherwise tidy.

The dealer options are both 2003s with 90K or 100k and seem reasonably tidy. The 6 speed auto ZF can have a new filter and oil change (did that when I first bought mine) -- is the same true for the transmission behind the BMW? Is the service as costly and as necessary?

I have read both sides of the BMW/Jag debate, and other than my preference for British (Jag -- yes I know its owned by the Indians) I have no preference for one over the other. However, I am curious about the other issues related to the vehicle age differences: the infotainment systems; the suspension bushings, the ancillaries, the Air con issues, trim issues, switch failures, general preference to early/late or other, transmission problems, fuel economy, whether or not people like the later infotainment system (with the real-time 4wd info -- I have the same or similar system in the LR3), the towing preference from BMW to Jag, etc. I rather like the infotainment system in the LR3 -- but, to be honest I don't actually use it all that much; and if moving from the $10,000 2003 to the $15,000 2006 is just a matter of getting a jag engine and the fancy infotainment system, I am not certain whether I can justify it (are early FFRR owners happy with the earlier satnav and stereo systems -- is there much of a difference between the two systems?)

Finally, on the 2003 models, is there any kind of bluetooth connectivity to a mobile phone? I really like the fact that my phone audio plays through the car stereo and I can hear people properly. I know that there is not much in the way of voice calling, and my 2006 LR3 has limited Bluetooth functionality, but I do use the stereo-speaker system for the phone all the time. Is there a auxiliary jack input for the earlier models -- in other words, can I play my iPod or phone through the earlier stereo systems? Also, do the pre 2003 have any kind of satellite radio in them (that's probably a question for the Canadian and American members) In short, can anyone advise me of the benefits of the 2006 over the 2003 or similar?

Fortunately, the climate in Alberta is über dry -- so rust is not an issue. Anyone have a quick list of check points when I look at them? (I am a mechanic and this will be my 43 Land Rover -- but only my second newer gen. thing; most of my stuff has been pre-2000).

With the above, there is a lifestyle question as to which suits who. I have a border collie and have farmed over the years as well as driven trucks -- I was also a mechanic, but only on my own vehicles now; it is likely that I will tow things in the future and have towed with the LR3. However, I also like refinement and luxury and have owned (in the past) a Bentley, several Jags, and and Aston Martin. I don't go off road much (they get all about that here in Alberta, and I am not an aggressive offroader, preferring the quiet trails and such), but do XC ski a bit. We go hiking a bit with the dog, and travel about a bit on road trips (tenting etc). I am not sure why I am not really happy with the LR3 -- I put a lot of thought into it earlier last year when I switched from my 40yo RRC, and I am not certain that I should have gone with the LR3 and should have picked the FFRR. If I get a FFRR, I shall not prep. the vehicle for expedition: I prefer FFRRs when they are original and refined; I shall probably put on more aggressive tyres as I recognise the value of good boots (I was RTV national champion a while back -- so I do know how to drive off road!)



2) Importing to the UK from Canada:

I might be headed back to the UK for my PhD studies (I am British) in which case I shall be bringing my FFRR (or LR3 if I can't sell in time) to the UK, and I wonder whether the FFRR or the LR3 is easier and cheaper to type approve (MOT). I believe that the adaptive headlights might be the only issue -- does anyone have any other guesses? I am told that there shall be an import tax to be paid (no surprise there then), but do they value the vehicle at what I paid for it, or what they consider it to be worth?

Has anyone imported to the UK from North America a vehicle like this -- if so, any advice?



Sorry for such a long post, but there are so many questions!

I'm going to get flamed for saying this and it sounds like your mind is made up but the 06 is much more reliable in engine and transmission (and front diff design though most of those diffs been fixed). On RR.net there are posts about water catchers ahead of the pcv valves that without them the engines will not start in prolonged cold in many areas of the USA have been reported. On the whole the 06-09 can be considered largely reliable, whereas I don't think most people would describe the 03-05 as reliable. The zf 5 speed is a liability in my mind, many reported rebuilds and issues on RR.net and across different makes with the same box.

I would get the zf 6 speed with the 4.4 lr/jag and change all the running gear fluids if it were me. I have one with 100k miles and thank the Lord she is a pleasure on road and off, she is reliable... For the Americas, only the 06 will have the jag engine and zf6 speed. If you get an 07, or 07 supercharged you'll get an updated interior that is more wear resistant and a rear ediff locker respectively in NAS market.

From reading on here it doesn't seem the 4.4 jag is as readily available in the UK.

Just be aware of some requirements for importing to UK. Particularly in connection with age of vehicle. https://www.gov.uk/importing-vehicles-into-the-uk/overview Not necessarily insurmountable but best to be aware as they might affect your choice. John
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2005 TD6 Java Black Vogue - Written off!!
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2003 Discovery TD5 Auto, Nanocom Evolution - gone to a new home!
MasseyFerguson 152 - No electronics!! - Sold

To be honest my advice would be if possible to return the car to standard unless you could get your asking price. Then all the other bits can be sold off to other disco owners on that side of the pond.

It would also mean you don't have to worry about any import faffing about. You can get good cars over here without having to start with repairing them.

You'll have enough on moving back to the uk and removing the stress of exporting and then importing a car will help. Also the fact it's a left hooker that's going to be NAS as well could lead to strange problems with parts and the vehicle config, and then resale of it when you move onto the next one  FFRR MY06 facelift With TDV8 Alloys Zeros/ATR's
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Thanks for the info, KingPleb -- but I am not bringing across the LR3 (well, hopefully not, anyway) -- I will be bringing across a L322 -- if things go according to plan.

I am committed to bringing something over because of the price difference: I can buy a nice 2006 L322 for £4000 -- but I can't buy anything like that in the uk for the same money. Also, Alberta has no rust at all. But there is the LHD issue. However, being an ex-continental truck driver, I have no issue with LHD things in the UK. “The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it.”

Weegie wrote:

Just be aware of some requirements for importing to UK. Particularly in connection with age of vehicle. https://www.gov.uk/importing-vehicles-into-the-uk/overview Not necessarily insurmountable but best to be aware as they might affect your choice.

cliff5.0sc wrote:

I'm going to get flamed for saying this and it sounds like your mind is made up but the 06 is much more reliable in engine and transmission (and front diff design though most of those diffs been fixed). On RR.net there are posts about water catchers ahead of the pcv valves that without them the engines will not start in prolonged cold in many areas of the USA have been reported. On the whole the 06-09 can be considered largely reliable, whereas I don't think most people would describe the 03-05 as reliable. The zf 5 speed is a liability in my mind, many reported rebuilds and issues on RR.net and across different makes with the same box.

I would get the zf 6 speed with the 4.4 lr/jag and change all the running gear fluids if it were me. I have one with 100k miles and thank the Lord she is a pleasure on road and off, she is reliable... For the Americas, only the 06 will have the jag engine and zf6 speed. If you get an 07, or 07 supercharged you'll get an updated interior that is more wear resistant and a rear ediff locker respectively in NAS market.

From reading on here it doesn't seem the 4.4 jag is as readily available in the UK.

Shedlock2000 wrote:

Thanks for the info, KingPleb -- but I am not bringing across the LR3 (well, hopefully not, anyway) -- I will be bringing across a L322 -- if things go according to plan.

I am committed to bringing something over because of the price difference: I can buy a nice 2006 L322 for £4000 -- but I can't buy anything like that in the uk for the same money. Also, Alberta has no rust at all. But there is the LHD issue. However, being an ex-continental truck driver, I have no issue with LHD things in the UK.

Sorry I was meaning to not even bother importing an L322 but run the disco until it's time to leave.

The problems with lhd is that some insurance companies have been known to be arsey or charge more for lhd vehicles, and I can understand why to a certain extent. But also when it comes to resale your uk market is very limited unless someone is in the market for a vehicle to use on holiday abroad a lot.
Yes it may be £4000 but then you have any repair costs before you bring it over, the shipping charges and fees and stress of sorting that, and then if it doesn't fall into the requirements for an duty exempt import possibly duty on top as well.

Just saying for me I couldn't be bothered with all that hassle just to save a few k and I am a tight arse by nature!! 😂😄
Run the disco, save up some more money and when you come across the money will no doubt get you nearly all the way there to a good one over here 👍 FFRR MY06 facelift With TDV8 Alloys Zeros/ATR's
Mantec Sump Guard, Rigid Load liner, MY10 BT upgrade.

That's useful thinking; I'll take a look into the import costs. One of the thoughts behind bringing the car across is that we have to ship a container of personal belongings anyway (in which the car could also fit). Shipping personal items any other way is a huge expense. As a student, saving money up is not an option, and my PhD program is expensive enough (hence the selling of the LR3 to fund a years worth of my program). So if I am paying $2500 for a container -- then there is no real extra cost in shipping a vehicle with it (apart from the registration etc.).

However, there are also added costs involved in registering and making legal whatever I chose to bring as well. It might be less expensive to buy something there. I have only had a cursory look around, but I have read a lot of posts on here suggesting how difficult it is to find a half decent L322 for any money there. Thanks for the advice, I shall have to crunch some numbers and see how much shipping something over and registering it actually coasts. “The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it.”

For infotainment and mobile phone, the BMW era stuff is quite outdated. However, it is also much easier to update with new bits from the BMW parts bin than the 2006.

Also, look seriously at American vehicles for export. They are usually cheaper and there's a greater selection. (Although the Can$/US$ exchange rate is making that a lot worse at the moment.

I might be wrong here but surly and Rang Rover bought in Canada will be NAS speck and that means different lights and LCM and to bring it to ROW spec to be legal to drive that would require new lights , LCM and loom ? It's no longer possible to just change the way lights are wired up with these cars . Again not insurmountable but left or right hand drive is far less of a problem compared to North American Spec to Rest of World spec in terms of making a car legal . Plus the UK doesn't have a personal import scheme for migrants like they do here in Australia meaning you will have to pay full taxes on everything making anything other than interesting vintage stuff and unusual new stuff really too expensive to bother with . 2008 MY Supercharged
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four zone climate
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and no ugly kid windows.
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