I've just bought a new caravan Sterling Elite Explorer twin axle (new old stock) & went onto my Caravan Club profile to update my outfit & guess what? The Caravan Club outfit matching service claims that this caravan is too heavy for the engine in my FFRR TD6 to cope with I was astonished so I checked the match on my old outfit (Bessacarr 535 SL) & it claimed the same thing was an issue! I towed the new caravan back up from Chesterfield on friday & it handled the caravan like a dream no problem on long hills etc, in fact I'd say its the best towcar I've ever owned Now whilst the TD6 is no match for the mighty TDV8 it easily copes with towing & the biggest problem was keeping my speed down
Rant over...Robert.

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if you have got problems i am stuffed!! i until recently towed my Buccaneer Clipper with the TD6 and it is heavier than your Sterling!! the TD6 managed just fine, even better after the remap, i may advise you to do this for the extra torque.

the main reason for the mis match if you like is the lack of power the TD6 produces, but it will tow the kind of weight involved with your Sterling all day every day!!

i have now upgraded to a TDV8 which has been mapped and was out with the plastic palace last week in The Lakes. you don't even know it's on the back, which isn't always a good thing!!

anyway i wouldn't worry about a thing and if you want a different point of view use the link i am including as you can change perameters with it for things like tyres and torque etc if you have a remap. in any case the Caravan Club recommend an 85% outfit match to keep thing safe, i think your outfit is only 70 something %

http://www.towsure.com/static/outfitmatch Current: TDV8 (3.6) RRS HSE



Past: TDV8(4.4) Vogue
Discovery 3 Commercial
TDV8(3.6) Vogue
TD6 Vogue
D2 V8 ES
D1 V8 ES
RR Vogue Classic

Sod the CC, they have no clue when it comes to outfit matching. It's all theoretical anyway, and despite many people's protestations, the "85% Rule" is mythical. Check the highway code, no such 'Rule' exists.

The figures to use when towing are:
Manufacturer's quoted towing weights
Manufacturer's quoted noseweight figure
DVLA quoted weights if you passed your test after 1997 AND you haven't taken the "+E" test to uprate your license.

NOTHING else is relevant from a legal perspective. As far as comfortable towing goes, balanced loading of the Tintent is the key.

Oh, and those caravanners who are most vocal about the 85% rule are usually the ones who arrive on site and get a few of their mates to push the van on to the pitch........or use a motor mover.....for a 12 foot van

Oh, and I have twin axle Coachman, which is as heavy a van you can find. Feels like it's been chiseled out of granite but the FFRR makes light work of it.

Dom

yes Dom the 85% rule is only a guide for the idiots out there who have no common sense!! you are correct and it is not a legal requirement, just a safety guide.

what is wrong with motor movers???...  Current: TDV8 (3.6) RRS HSE



Past: TDV8(4.4) Vogue
Discovery 3 Commercial
TDV8(3.6) Vogue
TD6 Vogue
D2 V8 ES
D1 V8 ES
RR Vogue Classic

Your Outfit get 5 Stars on Tow Car Info:

Tried that website for my outfit but it thinks I have a 6 speed box not 8.

Five stars in all the performance tests but only 3 on the stability triangle.

Ian

Re the 85% rule some police forces are looking to prosecute in the event of an accident for Due care if you are over it. As far as I know its not the law and I dont know of any sucessful prosecutions but it was discussed on a caravan forum a little while ago so it may become the future.

Just keep it under 100% which should be easy with a FF.
And remember the car salesman will tell you it will tow anything the caravan salesman it can be towed by anything right up to the point you are upside down on the M5  Mine was a blue one!

Well with some of the pictures of what i've seen disco 3/4 and FFRR pulling caravans should be a doddle, especially if they have alko anti away type hitches  FFRR MY06 facelift With TDV8 Alloys Zeros/ATR's
Mantec Sump Guard, Rigid Load liner, MY10 BT upgrade.

Cheers for all the advice guys. The caravan has the ALKO stabiliser on the hitch & the ATC system fitted, I'm also very very careful when loading the caravan & with the noseweight. It just seemed bizzare that The Caravan Club err so very far on the side of caution.

The TD6 has been remapped & is swift of foot at all times, so long motorway hills are a breeze as well as pulling off on uphill driving.

All of this begs the question of the 85% rule, I know that its a grey area but with full sized 4x4s many can tow up to 3500kg & thats from the people who make the cars Land Rover, Kia, Mitsubishi etc, I wonder how the police would look upon these situations, it really is about as clear as mud.

Its really crazy what some people will tow with ordinary cars, I was at a horse event on monday & there were two modern horse trailers that stood out. One was being towed by a Mondeo diesel & the other by a Citroen Xara diesel. Now my Ifor Williams horse trailer can legally weigh up to 2400kg when fully laden & the thought of ordinary cars pulling these kind of weights scares the living daylights out of me. I believe that new legislation states that the vehicle towing the trailer must now be capable of towing the fully laden weight of the trailer that it is towing as opposed to what weight it actually is, this rule seems to make a lot of sense.

Robert. The reason women's minds are cleaner than a mans mind is that women change their minds more often!
When women say fine a mans in deep doodoo as fine has so many meanings.

Last edited by ambulancekidd on 10th May 2012 9:24pm. Edited 1 time in total

My understanding is you cant tow more than the kerbweight of the vehicle anyway. The maximum tow figure given by a vehicle manufacturer is the maximum the vehicle can restart with on a gradient ( I think 12%) so a vehicle might be rated to tow say 3500kgs but it cannot leagally tow on the road any more than the kerb weight say 2500kgs for a FF unless a commercial vehicle. However I suspect somebody will correct me if I am wrong  Mine was a blue one!

You can tow more than the kerbweight but the critical figure is the train weight, it is illegal to exceed the train weight.

Ian

However you commit an offence if you exceed the vehicles max tow weight or train weight.
If you past your test before 1/1/97 you can have a train weight of 8.25 tonnes
after that you are limited to 3.5 tonnes unless you take an additional test.
So your FF is 2.5 your van /trailer 1.5 and you passed test after 1997 you need the additional category on your licence! Mine was a blue one!

NONE of this is difficult to understand, none of it is a grey area and it's not confusing in the slightest.

Whatever the handbook says, in the case of the FFRR it's 3500KG, is the maximum permissible trailer mass. This assumes the vehicle is not loaded to the point where towing 3500KG would exceed the maximum train mass, or that with the noseweight of the trailer, the maximum loading for the rear axle is not exceeded. That's it. Simple.

Regardless of what people might say, and regardless of the urban myths around the rozzers trying on the "Due care and attention" BS, as long as you are within the rules quoted by the car manufacturer, the trailer manufacturer, the licencing rules and the VOSA rules, you are perfectly legal. It really is black and white, all you have to do is RTFM.

Oh, and cue the video of a completely illegal example.

That was your 1000th posting mate! I agree that if you sit down & read the rules then they are quite clear, what makes the waters muddy are groups like The Caravan Club handing out daft quotes, people have a real tendancy to take their advice as gospel, its hardly helpful. We sold our Discovery this year to buy the FFRR but we tended to tow with our 2011 Galaxy 2.0Tdci powershift & that was simply to save costs on fuel. My next door neighbour pulled me aside one day when we had the outfit hooked up & questioned the weight issue, he was amazed to read the cars handbook on gross train weight & towing weights, the car was perfectly able & legal to tow the Bessacarr 535Sl but only just. The neighbour had always followed the advice given to him by The Caravan Club so this advice does lead people astray.
Robert.

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Urban myth or not the police looking at prosecuting above 85% was big news on the caravan forums, both clubs mentioned it in the magazines and made representations to the police. However I agree the clubs advice tends to er to caution and you would have to go some to overload any Sport Disco or FF. However my point about your driving licence is valid if issued after 1996 whatever the vehicle is rated to. Mine was a blue one!