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AndyS



Member Since: 27 Feb 2016
Location: Lymington, Hampshire
Posts: 402

United Kingdom 
Resale restrictions

Has anyone who’s ordered a new L460 been told they have to sign an Indemnity Deed restricting your rights to sell the car on the open market within an agreed mileage and time frame, is this legally enforceable?

Post #620752 21st Jan 2022 9:52am
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GAC23



Member Since: 27 Nov 2013
Location: Herts
Posts: 670

United Kingdom 2015 Range Rover Vogue SE SDV8 Indus Silver

Suggests LR are expecting short supply and worried people will flip their new cars for a healthy profit.

Quite why that's an issue for LR I have no idea. What do I put here then?

Post #620755 21st Jan 2022 10:50am
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Snowy90 L322



Member Since: 24 Aug 2015
Location: Surrey
Posts: 220

United Kingdom 2004 Range Rover HSE Td6 Giverny Green

I cant imagine it would be enforcable, unless you have a track record of such actions.

Things change people sell on.

JLR should focus on quality and customer service rather than hindering sales!

Post #620756 21st Jan 2022 11:07am
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Goldstar



Member Since: 04 Dec 2021
Location: Reading
Posts: 117

2011 Range Rover Autobiography TDV8 Stornoway Grey

They can ask you to sign what they like but if you pay for the goods and they become yours then I think they would have some issues enforcing. Not sure if you buy it on PCP or similar though as you don't own it.

Post #620759 21st Jan 2022 11:37am
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stenh02



Member Since: 30 Jan 2011
Location: Somewhere not warm
Posts: 341

Scotland 2004 Range Rover Vogue 4.4 V8 Rimini Red

There was always rumours Porsche did similar for the high end stuff but it may mean the dealer won't sell to you again. Or not put you on the waiting list for anything..

But only hearsay.

Post #620760 21st Jan 2022 11:40am
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Goldstar



Member Since: 04 Dec 2021
Location: Reading
Posts: 117

2011 Range Rover Autobiography TDV8 Stornoway Grey

I think Porsche do it slightly differently on their top end GT cars by offering a buy back to avoid the buyer seller on the open market and then offering them another allocation - allegedly

Post #620761 21st Jan 2022 11:45am
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AJGalaxy2012



Member Since: 11 Jun 2018
Location: Gainsborough
Posts: 1464

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Vogue SE 4.4 V8 Bonatti Grey

I'd tell them where to go, if I bought a car from them it's my property to do what ever I want with. What difference does it make anyway, if I buy a car and sell it the next day, what have they lost? BMW i3 Electric Car
2012 Full Fat RR 4.4 TDV8 (now gone)
2006 VW Touareg 3.0 TDi V6

Post #620762 21st Jan 2022 11:50am
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CS



Member Since: 14 Apr 2015
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 1374

Scotland 2017 Range Rover Autobiography 5.0 SC V8 Corris Grey

The "loss" is that loyal customers who want to have the cars get Censored off if they see traders getting part of their dealer's scarce allocation and then flipping them quickly at a profit, and maybe go and buy something else. The precedent just now is with Defenders, which can apparently be sold immediately at a profit of about £10,000. See for example the second hand prices on LRAU Defenders.

Apparently franchise terms oblige dealers to try to exclude these situations and they can be penalised financially if they cannot prove they have done their best to do so. With the sale contract with the buyer being with the dealer rather than with LR, the idea might be that a breach of the undertaking not to re-sell within certain parameters would allow the dealer to recover the amount of any penalty they have to pay to LR from the customer. It is hard to see that working, unless the dealer had made this risk to the dealer clear to the customer when it got the undertaking, as it's probably not a loss that is reasonably foreseeable for the customer otherwise. So it is maybe intended more as a deterrent than a likely basis for a claim, but the point above that people doing it won't get new cars again is probably right, at least in times of vehicle shortages.

There are of course no end of reasons other than wanting to make a quick turn for selling a relatively new car, e.g. health problems, changes in family circumstances, loss of access to leisure activities that necessitated the vehicle etc. So it would be pretty hard to draft an undertaking that catered for all of that and would be seen as fair by a court. Only Range Rovers since 1988

Post #620765 21st Jan 2022 12:23pm
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Ajay(UK)



Member Since: 02 Mar 2010
Location: Arundel, W. Sussex
Posts: 608

United Kingdom 2015 Range Rover Autobiography SDV8 Indus Silver

We've had our new Defender for just over six months now and could easily sell for at least a £10k profit but have no desire to as we love the car so much, and what would we replace it with? Confused

As soon as the L460 PHEV prices are confirmed and the configurator updated I will probably place my order for a P440e for delivery whenever it comes from the same supplying dealer. I doubt I will be expected to sign a disclaimer but if they ask I will sign.

However my main point is; if the dealer qualifies and knows their prospective customer first they will have a pretty good idea if there is a risk of flipping or the car appearing on an Indy forecourt near you soon at an inflated price Evil or Very Mad As far as I am aware a main dealer is under no obligation to give up one of their precious build slots even if they are waving pound notes in front of them. They have the right to say no and sell their allocation to whoever they choose. Whistle

Surely this would give them far better protection against the risk from any JLR financial penalty/claw back, rather than that of a likely unenforceable piece of paper Rolling Eyes

Andy. 2015 L405 SDV8 Autobiography, Indus Silver with Black Pack.
SWMBO: 22MY Defender 110 HSE X Dynamic, Gondwana Stone.
Gone: 2014 Discovery 4 HSE Luxury Firenze Red
Gone: 2006MY Java Black TD6 Autobiography
Gone: 2013 Jaguar XKR Convertible, Italian Racing Red with Ivory Seats
Gone: 2010MY Stornoway Grey TDV8 Vogue SE with RSE
Gone: 2008 Disco 3 HSE, Hybrid Tv + Retro-fit RSE System & DVD
Gone: 2003 Epsom Green 4.4i Vogue, LPG, Mk4 Nav, BMW Bluetooth Phone, Hybrid Tv Tuner,

Post #620783 21st Jan 2022 2:04pm
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aja500



Member Since: 15 Oct 2017
Location: South East
Posts: 818

United Kingdom 2019 Range Rover Autobiography 5.0 SC V8 Aruba

Personally, I think it's there to stop dealers taking the Mick, rather than private buyers who may change their mind.

If a car dealer were to continue buying and then selling new cars to obtain a profit, I don't doubt that JLR would take action against these people. However, if you're "Joe Bloggs" and you do this as a one off, or perhaps order and then decide you don't like the car, I very much doubt any action would be taken against you.

In short, it's only if an individual / business makes a habit of this, that they will face JLR in court.

Post #620859 21st Jan 2022 9:12pm
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Autobiography



Member Since: 10 May 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 922

2018 Range Rover SVAutobiography 5.0 SC V8 Santorini Black

Not uncommon but in practice very difficult to enforce.

Post #620879 22nd Jan 2022 7:56am
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alanm_3



Member Since: 19 Feb 2011
Location: my House, unless I’m not at home, in which case I’m somewhere else.
Posts: 6723

Scotland 2017 Range Rover Autobiography SDV8 Loire Blue

Very similar to buying a new Rolex steel sports model at RRP. Got - 2017 SDV8 Autobiography in Loire Blue
Had- 2008 TDV8 Vogue SE in Java black
Had - 2007 S/C in Stornoway Grey

Post #620881 22nd Jan 2022 8:13am
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jez000



Member Since: 17 Apr 2009
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 739

United Kingdom 2011 Range Rover Vogue SE TDV8 Bournville

I had to sign one for my L405 that I collected in December which I was a little surprised about. The dealer said it was due to limited stock availability and level of discount. As above I think it would be difficult to enforce and they are just trying to discourage people who think they can make a quick buck selling to someone who doesn’t want to wait. That practice has been going on for a while though especially for higher end cars so the people who flip on a regular basis must have relationships with dealers who don’t mind maybe due to volumes of sales. 2021 P400 Silicon Silver AB
Gone 2011 Bournville TDV8 VSE
Gone 2008 Black Canadian HSE LUX

Post #620884 22nd Jan 2022 8:16am
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AndyS



Member Since: 27 Feb 2016
Location: Lymington, Hampshire
Posts: 402

United Kingdom 

They do 'allow' you to sell the vehicle back to the dealership just not to the non franchised independants thereby keeping it within the network. I can understand that but it concerns me that they can dictate the price levels instead of letting the market decide what it's worth.
If you sign up then sell outside of the franchise I expect they will potentially stop you buying another but only until the volume starts to get back to normal and then they'll be glad of your business.
I have to sign up or no car in May but I can't see that it will cause me any issues as I have a good relationship with my dealer.

Post #620888 22nd Jan 2022 8:33am
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supershuttle



Member Since: 20 Mar 2011
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 3779

England 2013 Range Rover Autobiography SDV8 Luxor

I think logic has to be applied, if you buy something it's yours. If you want to sell it be it because of circumstances (or profit) thats surely up to you. After all the dealer will have paid JLR a lower price than they sold it to you.

Obviously, the dealer doesn't have to sell to you and maybe they won't if you don't sign the agreement (which as others have suggested may be difficult to enforce) Geoff

Post #620895 22nd Jan 2022 9:19am
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