Hi Kot, yes normally, I would agree.
But, in this case, the regen kicked in at half the average distance, and when almost none of the “warm up” conditions or even possibly speed, had been reached.
In other words, high soot % can and will override everything, which increases the chances of a failed regen due to road & traffic conditions.

Call it “Regen or Bust” mode

Just something for peeps to be aware of, and not sail too close to the wind…… planning is everything. “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” -where’s the fun in that?

Hi, there seems to be some folks who are thinking fuel in the oil is down to failed DPF regenerations, this is not true, fuel gets into the sump during the exhaust stroke regardless of whether the regen is successful or not as the DPF is downstream of the exhaust port, i.e. the diesel (or most of it) has already passed through the engine before it reaches the DPF.

There is a case to say that if the engine is turned off that any unburnt fuel in the engine does not get blown out the exhaust and therefore trickles down into the sump, but this is also a false flag as the same would apply to normal operation when the engine switched off mid stroke regardless of if a regen were active or not.

The truth is, it happens because of porus rings, i.e. the better the ring sealing the less likely diesel is to get to the sump, worn rings, scored bores or in the occasional instance where the ring gaps actually align during the process will make the problem worse. a coked up engine is actually a good thing in this regard as there is less chance of unburnt fuel reaching the sump. Fuji White / Jet 2012 4.4 TDV8 Westminster

@AndyRoo:

You are not quite correct in what you say, during the regen process the engine is deliberately overfuelled. If the process is interrupted, it will reinitiate again and again until it succeeds. This extra fuel increases the dilution effect. The engine management algorithm takes account of this, and drops the MTS accordingly.

No-one is saying diesel from the exhaust can find its way into the sump, that’s absurd.

There are a few good reference articles on this subject which make interesting reading. “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” -where’s the fun in that?

Hi, thanks for the explanation, every day is a school day

Andy Fuji White / Jet 2012 4.4 TDV8 Westminster

Gremlin500 wrote:

Hi Kot, yes normally, I would agree.
But, in this case, the regen kicked in at half the average distance, and when almost none of the “warm up” conditions or even possibly speed, had been reached.
In other words, high soot % can and will override everything, which increases the chances of a failed regen due to road & traffic conditions.

Call it “Regen or Bust” mode

Just something for peeps to be aware of, and not sail too close to the wind…… planning is everything.

One of the trigger points is the average distance between Regens.

Of course if you do a lot of 30-40mph events then soot load will of course rise faster than the average distance etc Thats why the soot grams pid, I now find, is a more useful guide to when its going to actually trigger. 2018 SE SDV8 4.4 Byron Blue

Ok, DPF gurus, I’m needing a bit of help making sense of these figures, I’m struggling to find the same values as previous posts using my IIDtool.

Ta

most of us are using a different dongle and software for measuring/monitoring the values.

I didn't find all of the values with the GAP tool, but I didn't spend lots of time looking as the other software was what was being used. SDV8 AB MY 2020
MINI Cooper S Cabrio
Kit: Jaguar XK140 (in progress - the website is link to build)

Hi Alan,

I agree with Kot, its better to use the Vgate BT dongle and Car Scanner Pro app dashboard, you can see it safely & clearly whilst driving.

Info at the beginning of this thread.

Price for both total under £20 now. “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” -where’s the fun in that?

I have a L405 2015 3.0 Hybrid (I posted about it earlier in the thread).

This model/year doesn't show the same sensors as everybody elses in the thread for some reason...

I've made sure that I am doing everything correctly and had help from the excellent luxmoggy (thank you for sending your dashboard to me) as well as contacting the developer. The developer didn't really work with my to find a solution just saying to add to my dashboard what sensors were available.

Here are some screenshots of sensors that I found that I thought might be relevant:

Click image to enlarge

Click image to enlarge

Click image to enlarge

AndyRoo wrote:

Hi, there seems to be some folks who are thinking fuel in the oil is down to failed DPF regenerations, this is not true, fuel gets into the sump during the exhaust stroke regardless of whether the regen is successful or not as the DPF is downstream of the exhaust port, i.e. the diesel (or most of it) has already passed through the engine before it reaches the DPF.

There is a case to say that if the engine is turned off that any unburnt fuel in the engine does not get blown out the exhaust and therefore trickles down into the sump, but this is also a false flag as the same would apply to normal operation when the engine switched off mid stroke regardless of if a regen were active or not.

The truth is, it happens because of porus rings, i.e. the better the ring sealing the less likely diesel is to get to the sump, worn rings, scored bores or in the occasional instance where the ring gaps actually align during the process will make the problem worse. a coked up engine is actually a good thing in this regard as there is less chance of unburnt fuel reaching the sump.

Hi Tony, I think you may have missed my response to Andy back up the thread. You were correct, it IS multiple failed regens which really rack up dilution. It’s a known fact that the JLR diesels suffer from dilution, due to the “remote DPF architecture” and the inability for passive regeneration to occur, at least to a significant level, when much of the driving is “short & slow”, hence the need for Active Regeneration.

Of course, if you don’t use the vehicle, you will not soot up the DPF, nor will it need to regen, nor will dilution happen, but that’s one expensive ornament sitting on the driveway!

Kot has very kindly posted up several scholarly articles on this subject, they make enlightening and interesting reading……. Well worth seeking them out and reading.  “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” -where’s the fun in that?

Thank you Gremlin500

CerebralThunder

The dpf value your looking to monitor out of those screenshots is the DPF soot concentration on an IIDTool.

On my 4.4 tdv8, it’s this value which builds up to around 20 ish in value, and then on a regen will burn down to about 6 or 7 iirc. ( i cant remember exact values, but its in those sorts of ball park figures ).

You then want to also monitor the exhaust temp sensors … on mine, the main one I monitor I think is bank 1 sensor 2 iirc. It’s the one which will see the temp rise way beyond 550degC on a regen, although I normally will select a few of the sensors to display to figure it which is the best one.

Lastly, simply monitoring the live mpg value can be enough to tell if the car is trying to build temp for a regen. On mine, if it’s time for regen, once up to temp, cruising on roads at around 50 will drop the normal live mpg figures down towards 22-24 instead of fluctuating above 30 on light throttle.

On the IIDtool, there doesn’t seem to be any option of display regen status like the other software talked about here …. Which is a pity, but hey ho.

I still think it’s bonkers that the car doesn’t display / report it’s doing a regen. V8 or else ...

@fisha

Thank you very much for the reply. I'll use the soot as a trigger point and also see if I can see the increased exhaust temperature as a reminder to keep driving..

What are your thoughts (and anybody elses) on the fact I'm over 800 miles since the last regen and still my soot concentration is only showing 14? Does that seem ok?

Thank you.

CT
We haven't come across your vehicle type before an hybrid V6, is it the same engine as the L405 non hybrid V6?

What profile are you using on the scanner app? it might be worth experimenting with the profiles.
If you are using Range rover profiles you can also look in Landrover profiles for a profile that has your engine etc The basic default profile is the OBDII profile that again might be worth trying for your case

You should be able to see at a minimum Exhaust temps, DPF soot grams, trigger %, DPF status (o,1 or 2) and you can set alarm/colour change etc so its noticeable when changes occur.

Over 800 miles is amazing when certainly the V8 manual states AR occurs at average of every 250 mile! maybe its the Hybrid influence? OR
It may be because you haven't got the correct profile saved for the car yet?

It would be interesting once you get all your settings in place to see the graphs. How does your Hybrid effect fuel consumption compared to non hybrid V6 as a matter of interest.

Graphs? go to Data recording and look at the saved files of each journey. You can pick what you want see below graph showing recent Active Regen

Click image to enlarge